does anybody care?

To 6strngs, I'm glad to hear you are feeling better.


I would just like to say that not all Christians believe they are superior b/c I am a Christian, ( I am a far cry from perfect however) and I don't feel superior to anyone (although I know some people feel that way). Also, the Law of Noncontradiction states that if something is true, the opposite if that is false. Example, If I said there is a red car sitting out in my driveway, and my buddy says there isn't a red car sitting in my driveway, one of us is wrong, pretty simple, both of us can't be right. Applying that to religion, if two religions contradict each other completely, the Law of Noncontradiction says only one can be right. But I agree with Ponyone, other people's faiths aren't really my business, We have the right to choose a religion whatever it may be and stick to it whole-heartedly, so more power to ya whatever that is. As I said in another post, to each is own. And 6strngs keep on keepin on, life's a garden, dig it. A little Joe Dirt for you there. :D

Originally Posted by: stackny
How did the things mention in your C group even come into this conversation? Lets first go to the fact that there are varying kinds of Christians. Catholics are a type of Christian and Im definitely not Catholic. Im evangelical so dont group me and real Christians in with the messed up versions of Bible observant religions. Everything you mentioned in C is something totally twisted and isnt actually Christianity. You know that. I know that. Lets not even go there.

I'm a Catholic. I don't go around slaughtering Jewish people or bombing abortion clinics, and I don't know any other Catholics who do. Similarly, the average Muslim doesn't go around beating women or flying airliners into skyscrapers, or condone such behaviour. Islam is not a "sick and twisted religion" any more than Christianity - it's just the extremist lunatics on the margins who perpetrate atrocities and disgrace their respective faiths. Both religions revolve around love, peace, respect, and social justice, and a closer study of the Bible and the Qur'an will reveal that they actually share a lot of common ground. I understand where you're coming from, but remember - never critique a religion based on what Rupert Murdoch tells you! :D ;)

Originally Posted by: stacknyI did neither. Its 2 different things. Apples and oranges. They cant be compared nor is one superior to the other. Do I think oranges taste better than apples? Yep, but not necessarily superior.

I don't know where to start on any of this. If you left it at what you said about none being superior you'd have been fine, but combined with everything else you are, in fact, subject to either delving into hypocrisy or confessing that you follow an atrocity. The thing that I've gathered from the many debates involving you is that you really don't give off the vibe that you've really read into what you defend. It seems as though part of the debate on your side is just defending yourself from something you'd said earlier. I could be wrong, though. It's just my observation on the situation.

Originally Posted by: 6strngs_2hmbkrshey, I'm alive, in case anyone was wondering. .

I'm very glad to hear it too Nathan!
SO.........
By now you must be able to see that:
1. People do actually give a damn.
2. You had some good advice among the replies.
3. There is always someone much worse off than you are.

Despite the fact that us guys don’t actually know each other – and I mean all of us in here – we share a common bond in that we are all musicians. That means we’re the creative types, and by merit fairly sensitive and expressive people, people who pick up on things maybe a little more than the average guy. You can also find comfort in the fact that it appears you do have friends in here, who do actually care. I’ve only been a member of this site for a week or so, and from what I’ve seen, you’ll not meet a bunch of more helpful, friendly and downright decent folk anywhere. It’s a pleasure to be among people like that, it really is.

Not everyone‘s life is great all the time buddy, and you’re only a kid really, you got it all in front of you, and things will get better. If we had it good all the time, we wouldn’t know the good times from the bad. Also, not everyone who picks up a guitar will become a rock star, it’s as simple as that, but if you have determination, and can harness that rage you feel into a controllable desire to get ahead, you’ll find that shopping carts and ill-mannered managers become something you can look back on and have a good smile about.
I did wonder (and worry) that you may just be pissed off enough to do something foolish, and that’s what it would have been, foolish. Would you rather be remembered as the mixed up kid, who took his life for no real reason other than he thought his life was no good, or be remembered as a good musician, the envy of your neighbourhood, and the type of person everyone wants to be with.

Just stick with it pal. If you feel depressed, do what I always did, and write a depressing song. I found that by doing that, the demons flowed onto the paper, rather than around my bloodstream in the form of an overdose. Listening back, I did some pretty dark stuff, and although I’m not known as a ‘Happy Song’ writer (my mother was always on at me “What can’t you write something happy?”) some stuff I wouldn’t even let my best friends hear. Once you learn to exorcise your devils, you’ll move ahead. It’s bottling stuff up that damages us, as the pressure builds to such a degree it just has to blow sooner or later. I’ll post a couple of examples of my low points on one of my sites (I’ll link below) and you can see, even though I’ve been around the world a few times, with some of the biggest names in music, it is NOT the key to happiness.

When I was younger I was permanently down, but it passed. I’m 45 on 25th May (a very young 45 I might add) and I am happier now than I’ve ever been. I still travel around doing my own thing (not too far though) and am still getting paid to do exactly what I began doing at 8 years old, sat strumming the yard brush at grandma’s house.
Life is out there waiting for you pal, and I know I’ve already told you this – and this goes for any of our pals here, who think it’s not happening for them – IT WILL NOT COME TO YOU, you have to go out there and actually believe you ARE the man. You’d be surprised, but if you believe in you, others will too. No one wants to be with a loser, someone who falls at the first hurdle.
Let’s have no more depressed talk in here? If it seems like I’m lecturing you, then you’re right. I wish to God I’d had someone to sit me down and explain that it would all pass one day. I spent years in a hell I’d made for myself, and there was only me that could see it.
Take god heed of all the positive messages you got in here, and use that positive vibe to your advantage. More :cool: and less :confused:

Originally Posted by: Cryptic ExcretionsI don't know where to start on any of this. If you left it at what you said about none being superior you'd have been fine, but combined with everything else you are, in fact, subject to either delving into hypocrisy or confessing that you follow an atrocity. The thing that I've gathered from the many debates involving you is that you really don't give off the vibe that you've really read into what you defend. It seems as though part of the debate on your side is just defending yourself from something you'd said earlier. I could be wrong, though. It's just my observation on the situation.

The fact is I dont think my religion is superior, I just think its correct. Does that necessarily mean its superior? Idk. Depends on how you define superior. I dont think it means people of my religion are better than Muslims I just think we're going to heaven and they arent, though we all hold the same opportunity.

Ive read into what I defend, just some Ive read into more than others. Why am I always defending myself? Cuz everyone on this board is a tolerant liberal who likes to pick apart everything I say. Duh.

Originally Posted by: stacknyThe fact is I dont think my religion is superior, I just think its correct. Does that necessarily mean its superior? Idk. Depends on how you define superior. I dont think it means people of my religion are better than Muslims I just think we're going to heaven and they arent, though we all hold the same opportunity.[/QUOTE]
Right there's what I'm talking about. It's not so much that you talk like your religion's superior, but you completely defecate on the rest. Comments like "I just think we're going to heaven and they arent" is a blatant and disrespectful way to talk about the tradition that someone else follows. Especially since there's no proof that either one is actually correct, you're basically just making assumptions. Think about it, would you like to be told that you're going to hell because you didn't believe in the same thing as the guy next to you?
[QUOTE=stackny]
Ive read into what I defend, just some Ive read into more than others. Why am I always defending myself? Cuz everyone on this bored is a tolerant liberal who likes to pick apart everything I say. Duh.

Of course we're (or at least I am) going to dissect everything you say. What do you want me to do? Pick and choose what parts of your argument that I want to hear and go with that? But that wasn't quite the point I was shooting for. What I was getting at is early on in a debate you say something, then later on you say something that contradicts what you'd previously said, then when presented these two thoughts you're left manuevering around your own words.

Originally Posted by: Cryptic Excretions Think about it, would you like to be told that you're going to hell because you didn't believe in the same thing as the guy next to you?

Obviously, no one wants to hear this. But in the defence of the religion, it is told out of love. Christians don't want to see people the know or love go to hell.

Cryptic, you and I see things the same way. Don't ever change.

Frick sakes, guys! Nobody wins religious debates, ever! You're not going to change anybody's mind, you'll never make anybody see things your way. Everybody thinks they are right, and nothing you say will change that. It's arguing for the sake of arguing. Why not argue about something where a conclusion might be drawn, an agreement of some sort can be found, and everybody can move on?

Originally Posted by: Cryptic ExcretionsRight there's what I'm talking about. It's not so much that you talk like your religion's superior, but you completely defecate on the rest. Comments like "I just think we're going to heaven and they arent" is a blatant and disrespectful way to talk about the tradition that someone else follows. Especially since there's no proof that either one is actually correct, you're basically just making assumptions. Think about it, would you like to be told that you're going to hell because you didn't believe in the same thing as the guy next to you?

But if you don't believe that, you don't even believe your own religion. I don't support telling other religions that they are stupid because it is their culture, but I believe 100% that they are all wrong. If I didn't believe this, I wouldn't belive my own religion.

Originally Posted by: stacknyAnybody who takes music to the level of Lamb of God, probably needs to be shot in the head. But thats just my opinion. Its like, lighten the hell up.

They should also remember they are heard by impressionable young men, like our own Nate. Joy Division had pretty much the same effect around 20 years ago. It may be that I'm older now, but artists do kinda have a duty of care to their target audience, and listeners should remember, they make a LOT of money through being provocative. They'd have been just as shocked by Nate's original post as we were, and I'll bet any money the Lamb of God guys love their mum's just like everyone else does.
Take it for what it is, just expression, and their OWN thoughts, don't read it as the gospel, or you will be screwed up. Personally, I too think they're garbage, but that's just my own opinion. Many people don't rate 'The Fall' as a band, but I love Mark E. Smiths lyrics.
If we all liked the same thing, there'd only be one album in the world. How boring would that be? ;)

Originally Posted by: stacknyPeople who cant figure out when someone is joking or exagerating also should be shot in the head. :D

People who think that people, who think people who think people think people should be shot in the head, should be shot in the balls instead.

Sheep of Gad

ps. I once wrote some lyrics, as part of a song called "Let's Get Real" that got me lots and lots of trouble. I was an angry young man at the time, and it was only 2 lines, but boy did I suffer for it, and for years too!

Originally Posted by: GaddyI once wrote some lyrics, as part of a song called "Let's Get Real" that got me lots and lots of trouble. I was an angry young man at the time, and it was only 2 lines, but boy did I suffer for it, and for years too!

What were the lines? If you can't say on here PM me.

Originally Posted by: acapella rapemeFrick sakes, guys! Nobody wins religious debates, ever! You're not going to change anybody's mind, you'll never make anybody see things your way. Everybody thinks they are right, and nothing you say will change that. It's arguing for the sake of arguing. Why not argue about something where a conclusion might be drawn, an agreement of some sort can be found, and everybody can move on?[/QUOTE]
That's why you don't debate with the intention of changing anyone's opinion. If I was worried about changing anyone's opinion then debating wouldn't be nearly as fun for said reasons.

[QUOTE=ericthecableguy]
But if you don't believe that, you don't even believe your own religion. I don't support telling other religions that they are stupid because it is their culture, but I believe 100% that they are all wrong. If I didn't believe this, I wouldn't belive my own religion.

That's a very legitimate point. And as far as levels of faith goes, that's something that I can't touch. All I can do is rebuttle with why it doesn't make sense to me. Namely because it just seems questionable that God would create a planet full of billions and billions of people only to knowingly send a the majority of them to hell even though they thought they were worshipping him how he wanted. God created man and he loves his creation dearly, but that's not going to stop him from sending is faithful followers to hell.

Originally Posted by: Cryptic Excretions
That's a very legitimate point. And as far as levels of faith goes, that's something that I can't touch. All I can do is rebuttle with why it doesn't make sense to me. Namely because it just seems questionable that God would create a planet full of billions and billions of people only to knowingly send a the majority of them to hell even though they thought they were worshipping him how he wanted. God created man and he loves his creation dearly, but that's not going to stop him from sending is faithful followers to hell.

Well, unless I am mistaken, God judges people not by their acts but by their hearts. If someone is doing what they feel is right, I don't think God would punish them just for ignorance. I believe that it's when someone intentionally goes against God, especially if they feel no remorse and do not seek forgiveness. I won't pretend to be some kind of religious expert, that's just my take on it.

I once read this Paul McCartney interview where he said that "God" is just "Good" minus a letter, and "Devil" is just "Evil" plus a letter. He also said he doesn't really believe in God or the Devil, just the basic principles of good and evil. Whether you believe in God or not (or a different God/Gods), I think you should just be a good person. Don't kill, don't rape. If it's something that harms another person, it's bad. Don't do it. If there is a heaven, chances are you'll make it in. If not, at least you were a good person. People will remember you for that.

Originally Posted by: acapella rapemeWell, unless I am mistaken, God judges people not by their acts but by their hearts. If someone is doing what they feel is right, I don't think God would punish them just for ignorance. I believe that it's when someone intentionally goes against God, especially if they feel no remorse and do not seek forgiveness. I won't pretend to be some kind of religious expert, that's just my take on it.

And if that's the case then no one holds any stance that allows them to believe someone else is wrong with their beliefs.

Originally Posted by: Cryptic ExcretionsAnd if that's the case then no one holds any stance that allows them to believe someone else is wrong with their beliefs.

You're exactly right.

Originally Posted by: jiujitsu_jesusI'm a Catholic. I don't go around slaughtering Jewish people or bombing abortion clinics, and I don't know any other Catholics who do.

Hitler was Catholic, was he not? Seems to me I read that somewhere else on the GT forum.

Originally Posted by: acapella rapemeYou're exactly right.

So to say it's part of your religious beliefs to believe that all others are wrong and will inherently go to hell for it, is wrong on its own. At least since everyone's doing what they truly believe and will be rewarded for it even though you think they're damned because their notes don't compare to yours. I guess if that's how God works then I should be ok, because I'm just speaking of things that make sense to me. And God doesn't banish people that follow their own sense of logic to hell, now does he?