What's Up !?!

"Now we're strokin'!" What is this? Nothing is being heard!
No wonder there's wimp guitar players. "Gotta' fit the mold, there's no money otherwise." Can't listen to a commercial without some old tune being stolen. Are you twits that incompetent? This old stuff is taking YOUR jobs away. You should be angry! These old farts (and advertising companies) are making money from your sheer stupidity! Get a grip. Whine about this theory. In the real world, if you can't read, or think... NO MONEY!!!
Like it, or NOT!!!

Originally posted by griphon2
[B "Gotta' fit the mold, there's no money otherwise." Can't listen to a commercial without some old tune being stolen. Are you twits that incompetent? This old stuff is taking YOUR jobs away.

*This is true in every genre of music today. Look at what orchestras' are playing. Jazz musicians are releasing cd after cd of old standards that have been reproduced a thousand times before. There seems to be a revival taken place over the past 15 yrs of getting back to roots. Even modern rock reminds me a bit of the music from the 50's, with its' lack or musicianship and repetitive forms.


You should be angry! These old farts (and advertising companies) are making money from your sheer stupidity! Get a grip. Whine about this theory. In the real world, if you can't read, or think... NO MONEY!!!
Like it, or NOT!!! [/B]

Unfortunately the recording industry is run by businessmen, not musicians. To offer them some new or different on that principle alone will get you nowhere. The recording industry see's itself as a public service, providing the public with what they want to hear. With the lack of music education in most school curiculums the general younger population has become an empty headed devourer of Rap music.

What's up with this?

Notice quote:
I'll have to wait til I have my guitar near to see how that sounds. In my head it sounds good though, alot of chromatic voice movements so I can't think of it exactly.

WHY?

An early lesson in my playing career from several established masters, SING before you PLAY. If you can't sing it, you don't know it! I am probably the worst singer in the world, but I can sing the pitches I PLAY. The most important lesson, I've probably EVER learned. It was a troublesome lesson long ago.

When you're schmcyking (sp), play everything you hear. On radio, TV, VCR, or DVD. You'll find out how good you are.
Remember each experience.

Originally posted by chris mood

*This is true in every genre of music today. Look at what orchestras' are playing. Jazz musicians are releasing cd after cd of old standards that have been reproduced a thousand times before. There seems to be a revival taken place over the past 15 yrs of getting back to roots. Even modern rock reminds me a bit of the music from the 50's, with its' lack or musicianship and repetitive forms.[quote]

I agree but why b*tch about it, just destroy your radio and make the music you want to hear.

[quote] You should be angry! These old farts (and advertising companies) are making money from your sheer stupidity! Get a grip. Whine about this theory. In the real world, if you can't read, or think... NO MONEY!!!
Like it, or NOT!!!

Unfortunately the recording industry is run by businessmen, not musicians. To offer them some new or different on that principle alone will get you nowhere. The recording industry see's itself as a public service, providing the public with what they want to hear. With the lack of music education in most school curiculums the general younger population has become an empty headed devourer of Rap music.

Yeah it's sad to say that that is true. Shortly after I finished H.S. they took way a big part of the music program there. And in college there is no innovations, just a hefty dosage of old rules that you have to swallow. Will the world ever learn what art really is.

I am in absolute agreement with you. Listening and singing is the key, even if you not that good at either. Good point. I dunno it's hard to hear it exactly when there is alot of small movements in the voicings along with key changes on those chords. I did get a chance to play it though, sounded good. I was 'dead on' hearing it without my guitar, just wasn't sure. The last chord was kind of tense, I like that even if it ends there.

Actually the college I went to was not like that at all, it was very contemporary. We had awesome ensembles ( Fusion big band, Brecker Bros. ensemble, Steely Dan ensemble, Zappa,a multi-tude of different latin ensembles, plus your traditional be-bop and swing jazz ensembles), it was like fantasy land for musicians. The big problem was that while in college you got to play all this great, fantastic music, but once you graduated and entered the real world you find the average Joe has no interest in this music and you are forced to play cheesy -poop in order to make a buck. The solution, I believe is in music education, listening is a learned skill that has to be taught, and once learned your ear will desire to hear lush harmonies, exotic melodies, and complex rhythms. The mass publics embrace of Rap music and techno dance is a result of a failed educational system. Quite sad.

Originally posted by noticingthemistake
I agree but why b*tch about it, just destroy your radio and make the music you want to hear.
[/B]

Quite honestly, I haven't listened to commercial radio in years. I have 2 public radio staions programmed into my car stereo that I listen to exclusively, one is a classical / jazz station (Temple Unv.), the other plays a variety of indie artists (Unv. of Penn).

I just realized I tabbed one of those chords wrong in that jazz progression. Fmaj7 is (xx3555), (xx3335) is Bb maj7, actually both work in the prog..

What college did you go to chris? I remember you saying you went for jazz performance or something. That sounds cool going to school for playing. Your may have not been what I was describing then. I know alot of schools will teach too many rules about music in theory or just basic practice. Then you learn this and hear it and maybe go, "oh that sounds good". Then you get stuck using that when you run into a situation. Very few people dare to change that or hear something different once they find out something sounds good. The popular thing to do now days is take a old progression from a hit song and recycle it, like you said. The concept of innovation takes a backseat.

Listening is something that has to be taught, but not rushed. Learning to listening is just something that comes with time rather than work. I don't like that about college courses, they rush you in ear training. You better have alittle under your belt before you get there or your in for a tough ride. Also because of this most wont get you to a high enough level because your always behind. It takes several years to learn how to hear a piece of music and know everything that is going on with just your ear and have a solid grasp on it. Also to be able to dictate a long phrase of music accurately before it's gone from the mind.

Yeah I don't listen to the radio much either. I do listen to classical music when I go to sleep though, helps me relax. Although sometimes I'll go weeks without listening to music at all just because I grow tired of what I've been listening to. Then I write what I don't hear.

1000th post Baby!!!!!!!!!!!

[Edited by noticingthemistake on 11-06-2003 at 11:24 PM]

"My whole life is a dark room...ONE BIG DARK ROOM" - a.f.i.

Permalink

I went to the University of the Arts, but there are lots of colleges out there that have great contemporary music programs: Unv. of Miami, Manhatten school, Berklee, Texas State, just to name a few.

Originally posted by noticingthemistake
Listening is something that has to be taught, but not rushed. Learning to listening is just something that comes with time rather than work.

It's both, actually. people are born with different degrees of pitch hearing, rhythmic abilities, etc....and a good teacher is going to know that and know how to address that. Plus, a good music program is going to have its ear traing courses split into levels or A B groups, so that students with advanced abilities get just as much out of ear training as those who don't. (ever take an ear traing or theory course w/a drummer, ugh talk about feeling pity). Personally, I found I really got my ear together when I started sitting down and transcribing. I spent my whole senior year w/my private teacher working on transcriptions: guitar solos, sax solos, piano parts, etc. I have manuscript books full of transcriptions.

As far as listening to music, what do you do when your in the car? I love listening music, I can weeks with out watching TV, but I have to have music around me. Record stores are like dangerous for me, I can't walk out of one without shelling out a hundred bucks.

Yeah I was thinking about looking into one of those schools, or just an art school in particular. My great grandfather did the same with traveling to different places to study, even the warsaw conversatory where Chopin studied. I think that would be rad to do that.

Learning to listen takes time, learning to use your ear takes work. It's like hearing a dominant 13th chord for the first time, first its strange and you probably wont be able to think of it in your mind or recognize it when you hear it in a piece of music. But as you listen to it more and more, you start to hear it in your head and notice it in music. That takes time and it's a different lenght of time for every person. Yeah drummers don't have a clue because they don't need to have an ear for pitch. Transcribing is the best way to learn how to use your ear, but as you get a grip on transcribing others' work. Try transcribing ideas out of your head next, start slow and work up to where you can transcribe your thoughts straight to music. It shouldn't end with transcribing others' but like in the dreaded english class where you were told to write so many pages of just your thoughts without stopping. Do that with music. In my opinion that's the ultimate in music, pulling your ideas out of your head clearly and quickly.

When I'm driving I do listen to something, but then again sometimes I don't. Especially if theres other people in the car and I'm not driving, I rarely pay attention to the song playing. Alone different story. I try to play more than I listen.

[Edited by noticingthemistake on 11-07-2003 at 10:32 AM]

In the car, I listen only to PBS. Unless, I'm on the rag. I can't believe the BS that's out there. It's depressing.