Liberal/Conservative, Freedom of Speech, etc...


Kevin Taylor
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04/13/2007 4:33 am
Originally Posted by: earthman buckYeah, Al Sharpton grates my chains too. I don't get what his deal is. If the best civil rights fight he can get into is whether not some gross old dude no one cares about should be fired for saying something stupid on the radio, civil rights have come a looooong way.

Not that I agree with what that guy said or anything, I just think "Who cares?"


yeah, that's about my attitude about the whole thing too.
Personally I can't stand that Imus dude. I'm kinda glad he's gone cause I would purposely skip past that channel in the morning cause his face sorta makes me wanna puke.
But I digress...
Sure, the gross guy shouldn't have said it. but he did.
He also apologized and was willing to meet the team to apologize in person. Great... accept the apology gracefully and lets move on instead of blowing it up into a media circus and ruining a guys career over it.
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earthman buck
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04/13/2007 5:00 am
Originally Posted by: schmangeyeah, that's about my attitude about the whole thing too.
Personally I can't stand that Imus dude. I'm kinda glad he's gone cause I would purposely skip past that channel in the morning cause his face sorta makes me wanna puke.
But I digress...
Sure, the gross guy shouldn't have said it. but he did.
He also apologized and was willing to meet the team to apologize in person. Great... accept the apology gracefully and lets move on instead of blowing it up into a media circus and ruining a guys career over it.

Yeah, I mean his job is to piss people off.

I hate to seem like some sort of dick or something, but I was on Michael Richards' side too with his whole thing. His first crack at the hecklers did make me laugh, he just took it too far.

I don't get how anyone can get upset over words. I really don't. If some black guys called me a cracker or honky faggot or something, I'd just shrug it off. And, you know, laugh. Because "honky faggot" is a hilarious thing to be called.
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hunter60
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04/13/2007 11:23 am
Originally Posted by: earthman buckYeah, I mean his job is to piss people off.

I hate to seem like some sort of dick or something, but I was on Michael Richards' side too with his whole thing. His first crack at the hecklers did make me laugh, he just took it too far.

I don't get how anyone can get upset over words. I really don't. If some black guys called me a cracker or honky faggot or something, I'd just shrug it off. And, you know, laugh. Because "honky faggot" is a hilarious thing to be called.


This is waaaaay beyond what some un-funny old dude said on the radio. This is the first round of what is going to become an old-fashioned knock-down, drag out fight on the First Amendment. There is nothing in the Constitution protecting anyone from having their feelings hurt. This is all about Free Speech. Hip-Hop and Rap are next. The films.Then books. And then....? Who knows. I will tell you this, be very, very vigilant.
These uber-right wing lunatics and politicial militants are gunning for your basic rights and freedoms.

Look, I've never thought Imus was funny. What he said was stupid and should never have been said. He knows that. With a 40 year career in radio, he's smart enough to have avoided this situation. But he apologized. I think he really does feel sorrow for what he said. He apologized to the team. What more? Suspend him - fine. But to fire him? So does that mean that we can expect that any time you say something that anyone else finds troubling or offensive that you can lose your livlihood?

I am a big believer and supporter of civil rights. But this is something way beyond civil rights. This is purely political. Either all speech is protected or none of it is.

Watch your back kids. This is just the opening salvo. :(
[FONT=Tahoma]"All I can do is be me ... whoever that is". Bob Dylan [/FONT]
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Kevin Taylor
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04/13/2007 1:22 pm
Originally Posted by: earthman buckYeah, I mean his job is to piss people off.

I hate to seem like some sort of dick or something, but I was on Michael Richards' side too with his whole thing. His first crack at the hecklers did make me laugh, he just took it too far.

I don't get how anyone can get upset over words. I really don't. If some black guys called me a cracker or honky faggot or something, I'd just shrug it off. And, you know, laugh. Because "honky faggot" is a hilarious thing to be called.


You know... Jay Leno made a joke the other day about English people having bad teeth. I think I'm going to call a press conference demanding his resignation dammit!!
Who's with me... blood pudding for everybody!! :rolleyes:
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hunter60
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04/13/2007 1:34 pm
Originally Posted by: schmangeYou know... Jay Leno made a joke the other day about English people having bad teeth. I think I'm going to call a press conference demanding his resignation dammit!!
Who's with me... blood pudding for everybody!! :rolleyes:



Yup! If I had called for the resignation or stoning of everyone who has ever made a crack about me...well, hmm, maybe I should darn it. My feelings are hurt!!! And I think I'll pass on the blood pudding. I don't know what that is and I think I am willing to let that curiousity pass. Thanks anyway! :D
[FONT=Tahoma]"All I can do is be me ... whoever that is". Bob Dylan [/FONT]
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Bar Chord Nick
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04/13/2007 9:46 pm
Originally Posted by: hunter60This is waaaaay beyond what some un-funny old dude said on the radio. This is the first round of what is going to become an old-fashioned knock-down, drag out fight on the First Amendment. There is nothing in the Constitution protecting anyone from having their feelings hurt. This is all about Free Speech. Hip-Hop and Rap are next. :(


When the lyrics to rap and hip-hop was brought to Sharptons attention he blamed the record companies for making these artist use derogatory and slang statements. You see the rappers would rather use "African American" as apposed to the "N" word but Sony and others makes them use it.
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04/13/2007 10:24 pm
Originally Posted by: Bar Chord NickWhen the lyrics to rap and hip-hop was brought to Sharptons attention he blamed the record companies for making these artist use derogatory and slang statements. You see the rappers would rather use "African American" as apposed to the "N" word but Sony and others makes them use it.


Ah...sure...that makes sense. :confused:

I know I sound like quite the doomsayer here some times, but I really do feel that we are in some strange and scary times. Not in every aspect, there is a lot of hope out there too. But so many basic freedoms are being attacked on all sides. Don't give up those things that soooo many have made great sacrifice, and many have died, to provide and protect. Freedom of speech is the cornerstone of a free society. Without the right to express yourself free of the fear of persecution, you are only a stones throw from a fascist state. It's not that much of leap to see that once you lose that right, it won't before long before you are no longer allowed to read, write, sing or play what you want.
[FONT=Tahoma]"All I can do is be me ... whoever that is". Bob Dylan [/FONT]
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Kevin Taylor
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04/13/2007 10:51 pm
Free speech doesn't exist as far as I'm concerned.
There's words you can't say in public without being ostracized. Words you can't write without being thrown in jail. Literature that you aren't allowed to buy.
Music, books, movies... even the internet is controlled.
So where's this so called free speech people keep talking about?
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hunter60
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04/13/2007 10:56 pm
Originally Posted by: schmangeFree speech doesn't exist as far as I'm concerned.
There's words you can't say in public without being ostracized. Words you can't write without being thrown in jail. Literature that you aren't allowed to buy.
Music, books, movies... even the internet is controlled.
So where's this so called free speech people keep talking about?


You're right. It's been slowly eroding for years and years and years and it will continue to do so. This sort of thing with Imus and the Rutger Basketball team is just a catalyst to further the fire along. But my point is, protect what you have left. You do have 'some' freedom of speech. Wouldn't it be a shame to lose what little is left?
[FONT=Tahoma]"All I can do is be me ... whoever that is". Bob Dylan [/FONT]
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Kevin Taylor
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04/13/2007 11:10 pm
****ing right.

... oh ****. totally forgot about them star things
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grizzlymint
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04/13/2007 11:47 pm
I don't blame this on the government at all. It really has nothing to do with government. What Don Imus said was uncalled for, however, he has his First Amendment right to say whatever he feels. However, as soon as you're employed and speak your mind on the radio, if you say what your employer doesn't like or thinks its bad for the company, you're gonna get your ass canned . Simple as that. Were his rights infringed on? No. He just got fired from a radio job for saying something stupid. He didn't get sanctioned by the FCC, he pissed off the black community and a lot of other people.

That being said, the uproar over this is absolutely ridiculous. Double standards are a bitch ain't they? To paraphrase Bill Cosby, "we've gotta stop calling each other *n word* if you don't want to be called the n word."

Thats all I gotta say about this.
Let your soul shine. Its better than sunshine. Its better than moonshine. Damn sure better than rain.
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hunter60
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04/14/2007 12:13 am
Originally Posted by: grizzlymintI don't blame this on the government at all. It really has nothing to do with government. What Don Imus said was uncalled for, however, he has his First Amendment right to say whatever he feels. However, as soon as you're employed and speak your mind on the radio, if you say what your employer doesn't like or thinks its bad for the company, you're gonna get your ass canned . Simple as that. Were his rights infringed on? No. He just got fired from a radio job for saying something stupid. He didn't get sanctioned by the FCC, he pissed off the black community and a lot of other people.

That being said, the uproar over this is absolutely ridiculous. Double standards are a bitch ain't they? To paraphrase Bill Cosby, "we've gotta stop calling each other *n word* if you don't want to be called the n word."

Thats all I gotta say about this.


Agree. This was not a government action. This was the gutless management at CBS Radio who reacted to the loss of advertisers who reacted to a threat of a boycott. The threat of a boycott was made by a handful of media clowns who claim advocacy and a belief that they are trying to bring the races together. With this sort of nonsense, it drives a deeper wedge. I agree that Imus said something stupid. Incredibly stupid. Especially for someone in the business for 40 years. My question is; what was the damage to the girls he was speaking of? Seriously. What were their damages? IF you do not like what someone says and IF you find some thing offensive, STOP LISTENING. If it bugs you, avoid it. Don't make an issue out of hurt feelings.

This really, really bugs me.

But yes, you're right. The government had nothing to do with this. This was society reacting.
[FONT=Tahoma]"All I can do is be me ... whoever that is". Bob Dylan [/FONT]
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Kevin Taylor
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04/14/2007 12:16 am
A double standard is definitely correct.

I'm watching a movie right now called "White Chicks" about 2 black FBI agents going undercover dressed as white girls.
I wonder what the reaction would be if this movie was called "Black Chicks"
about 2 white FBI agents going undercover dressed as black girls.
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hunter60
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04/14/2007 1:38 am
Originally Posted by: schmangeA double standard is definitely correct.

I'm watching a movie right now called "White Chicks" about 2 black FBI agents going undercover dressed as white girls.
I wonder what the reaction would be if this movie was called "Black Chicks"
about 2 white FBI agents going undercover dressed as black girls.



The uproar from something like that would be thunderous. It's amazing how there was not a word said about 'White Chicks' (other than it being a horrid movie) and if they did a movie called 'Black Chicks', it would unleash a torrent of vitriol.
[FONT=Tahoma]"All I can do is be me ... whoever that is". Bob Dylan [/FONT]
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Kevin Taylor
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04/14/2007 2:09 am
Originally Posted by: hunter60The uproar from something like that would be thunderous. It's amazing how there was not a word said about 'White Chicks' (other than it being a horrid movie) and if they did a movie called 'Black Chicks', it would unleash a torrent of vitriol.


I'm planning on calling a press conference tomorrow calling for the immediate recall of "White Chicks" from circulation.
Not cause it's racist or sexist or anything... but because it REALLY SUCKED!!

Seriously man, I gave it a chance but after 30 minutes I couldn't handle it anymore.
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Lordathestrings
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04/14/2007 4:49 am
Originally Posted by: hunter60.... There is nothing in the Constitution protecting anyone from having their feelings hurt. This is all about Free Speech. Hip-Hop and Rap are next. The films.Then books. And then....? Who knows. I will tell you this, be very, very vigilant.
These uber-right wing lunatics and politicial militants are gunning for your basic rights and freedoms. ...


Political Correctness is [u]not[/u] a right-wing concept. It is part and parcel of the lefty social engineering that is destroying Western civilization. Al Gore's wife Tipper was the one trying to ban 'objectionable' music, remember?

Set aside 47 minutes of your time, and be prepared to THINK about what this guy says.

>youtube clip<
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Kevin Taylor
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04/14/2007 5:39 am
Originally Posted by: LordathestringsPolitical Correctness is [u]not[/u] a right-wing concept. It is part and parcel of the lefty social engineering that is destroying Western civilization. Al Gore's wife Tipper was the one trying to ban 'objectionable' music, remember?

Set aside 47 minutes of your time, and be prepared to THINK about what this guy says.

>youtube clip<



I'm about 20 minutes into it and had to stop and comment.
The guy seems to be on the ball and is definitely capable of putting his thoughts together. I agree with a lot of what he says.
However, I startedd noticing that his definitions for certain movies and music don't seem right on the ball. I think my first reaction was with his take on what the words to Imagine by John Lennon are. Maybe it's just me but my first thought was "that's not what Johnn Lennon was trying to say".
From then on as he keeps talking I'm noticing that his take on the plotss of movies are not quite right either....

Now he's talking about democrats, liberals and conservatives... and I don4l....nn.....77

blah, sorry gotta ddo a restart andn change somoe batterieis. My wireless keyboard is actting wieird
I'll be bach...
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Kevin Taylor
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04/14/2007 5:52 am
Well that was fun. :)

Anyways... I''m about 20 minutes iinto this thing and argh...
Ok... I thiink itt's my iinternet conection. This happened lastt weekend too.
Bottoom line is, I so far his thought process doessn't seem to be messhing with mine. 'll finish wwatcchingg it, buut
****...neveer mind damned Rogerrrs Cabl
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hunter60
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04/14/2007 12:11 pm
Originally Posted by: LordathestringsPolitical Correctness is [u]not[/u] a right-wing concept. It is part and parcel of the lefty social engineering that is destroying Western civilization. Al Gore's wife Tipper was the one trying to ban 'objectionable' music, remember?

Set aside 47 minutes of your time, and be prepared to THINK about what this guy says.

>youtube clip<


LATS, I will gladly watch the clip a little later today when I have a chance. I don't mind admitting when I'm wrong on something (seems to happen a lot!! :D ) but I would never categorize Tipper Gore as a leftist. Al is the leftist in that relationship. Tippers charge into parental warning labels was neither a right or left thing. That was a middle-aged woman thing. Look at who her supporters were. Other middle-aged women from both sides of the political camp. That was a uniting issue, not a left/right issue.

From my left of center viewpoint, I see infringments on expression coming from the right. It has always seemed to me that the right, although masters of polictical manipulation, seem to be more inclined to oppose difference in opinion and the voicing of dissent. Trouble with the left is that they accept any and all opinions and try to appease every single special interest out there. We all know that's not possible. You try to please everyone, you end up pleasing no one.

And I'll admit that I did over-simplify my original point. Generally speaking, freedon of speech and the apparent loss of the same is generally done, not by governments, at least not here in the US, but by society at large. We are a society made up of special interest groups motivated by their victimization. "Don't say that, it hurts my feelings." So now, we are looking at, in a serious fashion, about banning a word. I despise that word. It's denigrating and stupid. If you can't express yourself any better than by using a word like that, then how can anyone take what you say seriously, you know? Trouble is, you 'ban' one word and you're off and running. You've opened the door to banning other words, ideas and other forms of expression.

I will watch the clip later. Thanks.
[FONT=Tahoma]"All I can do is be me ... whoever that is". Bob Dylan [/FONT]
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Lordathestrings
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04/14/2007 7:54 pm
I offered that clip as an illuminating insight. The speaker is passionate about his beliefs, and that can somtimes be upsetting to the viewer. And, as schmange pointed out, his take on music lyrics and movie plots is coloured by his views. Like any other human being.

What I found particularly interesting is his analysis of how and why the liberal-left is so virulently opposed to any view that runs counter to the accepted group-think. His assessment of the school system gave me chills.
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