Liberal/Conservative, Freedom of Speech, etc...


hunter60
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hunter60
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04/15/2007 12:39 pm
Originally Posted by: schmangePersonally, I think they're just gonna crawl back into their hole and wait for 'whitey' to make another stupid mistake again.


I think you're right on point here Schmange. This is something that should have never exploded into the level it did. It was a stupid thing for Imus to have said but he said it. The Rutgers team met with him and accepted his apology. CBS should have suspended Imus IF he had violated their stated on-air policies. If not, then reprimand him and let it go.

But, and here's the problem, much like good ol' conspiracy theories, if you look hard enough into something, you can find a conspiracy in everything. In this case, those willing to look hard enough, were able to turn this from a stupid attempt at being funny and outrageous into something hateful and racist.

It's a dangerous thing to move from advocate to conspirator. I have to wonder what MLK would have thought about this incident. Not only do you have those who want to turn this into something it's not, but you have to add a healthy dose of white guilt in there too and you end up with the media circus that it eventually became.

I hate to see this sort of thing because it is far more devisive than it is inclusive.

Have you ever wondered if maybe the reason that we are in such a strange time now is because these are the last throes of the group of folks who lived through the Civil Rights and Anti-Establishment movements? I would like to think that things will be different a few generations from now.

Of course, I'll be long gone by then so I guess I'll never know.... :rolleyes:
[FONT=Tahoma]"All I can do is be me ... whoever that is". Bob Dylan [/FONT]
# 1
Logan826
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Logan826
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04/15/2007 12:45 pm
Who ever said it before was correct. This whole thing has nothing to do with racism (sp) or politics. Bottom line is this is a media whore jumping on the band wagon, once again, and stepping on "freedom of speech" to suite his/their needs. I hate to turn the direction of this thread and this is not my intention with what I'm going to say, but it does fall into the same group. Freedom of speech holds hands with freedom of religion. These minority groups, and I'm not speaking of a color. Stand up and say " I don't want my kids reading Bibles in school, or viewing pictures of Christ in school" Soooo, because a small group speaks up, we loose that right. Well folks, Where is my freaking right to WANT to have my kids read a bible in school or view a picture of Christ when they walk through the door. Same goes with Freedom of speech. If a black person can call another black person a "nappy headed ho" and get away with it, why can't I. We hear black people calling each other "******" (I personally hate this word, i'm just making a point) every day they do it in songs, on TV, Radio, everyday life, and not one sinlge Al Sharpton, or Jesse ****ing Jackson will say a word. But may fire shoot straight out of hell if a white person even makes any sort of reference to this. I love my country and the freedoms that we have and if these stupid media whores don't stop sometime this whole "Freedom of anything" is going to back fire on them and they will have in time takin' the rights that they are "fighting for"(and I use that term very loosely) away.
JMHO,
Dan
# 2
hunter60
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hunter60
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04/15/2007 1:02 pm
Originally Posted by: LordathestringsPolitical Correctness is [u]not[/u] a right-wing concept. It is part and parcel of the lefty social engineering that is destroying Western civilization. Al Gore's wife Tipper was the one trying to ban 'objectionable' music, remember?

Set aside 47 minutes of your time, and be prepared to THINK about what this guy says.

>youtube clip<



LATS, I did listen to most of this and he is a terrific speaker. Very engaging and he does make some very, very solid points. But, and I mean with this with all due respect, he does the very same thing that he accuses of the left - the underlying theme was 'If you don't agree with me, you're wrong.' That troubles me. Actually, it troubles me from both ends of the spectrum because both sides (and we're talking the extremes of both sides) take this very same approach. It seemed that he said that the left promotes evil and vile thoughts through art, movies,music...etc. I can't agree with that thought. Sure, some might but that's not the whole idea.

I should clarify something; I do not make any of these as blanket statments. Both sides, both left and right, have their extremists and these are the people that create this poo-storm that we read about and hear about through the media. I don't disagree with a lot of Republican thoughts. I really don't and I don't accept everything that the Democrats say either. But I do react when I see something coming that just smacks of totalitarist thoughts.

The two most dangerous words in the English language are 'always' and 'never'.

I doubt seriously that a restriction of the freedom of speech (or any freedom or right) is something being attacked by any particular group. It's not. It's society. Political Correctness is not a document created in the Senate and signed by the President. It is a reaction from the public to the pressures it puts on itself. White guilt. An deep and abiding anger by minorities to a past that can not and never will be rectified. And a aching for an apology that will never be able to assuage the horrors inflicted over the past. It's the result of people wanting to wipe away the sins of our forefathers without recognizing that no matter how fast you run, you can't escape the past.

So no, I don't blame the Right nor do I accept the rhetoric of the Left. I have to look to society, to us, to try to right this ship that is listing heavily under the collective guilt that we carry.

I love my country. Always have and always will. If someone asks me my nationality, I will always say 'American' and not German-Italian. And when I say American, that means both right and left and the fully respected sense of debate that is the true gift given to all of us.

Thanks for the link. I found it very illuminating.
[FONT=Tahoma]"All I can do is be me ... whoever that is". Bob Dylan [/FONT]
# 3
z0s0_jp
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z0s0_jp
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04/15/2007 1:52 pm
"Freedom of Speech" does not need small print under it telling me what I can and can't say. I have a shirt that says "who made Tipper Gore God?" in big bold letters on back

by the way... honky was a term for the white guys driving into a black neighborhood and honking their horn when they wanted to have hookers come out to their car. OMG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :eek:.... ;)
"Dammit Jim!! I'm a guitarist not a roadie...so haul my gear"
# 4
Lordathestrings
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Lordathestrings
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04/15/2007 4:19 pm
Originally Posted by: hunter60LATS, I did listen to most of this and he is a terrific speaker. Very engaging and he does make some very, very solid points. But, and I mean with this with all due respect, he does the very same thing that he accuses of the left - the underlying theme was 'If you don't agree with me, you're wrong.' That troubles me. ....


I think that in order for anyone to stand up in front of a group of people and explain their beliefs, and how they were arrived at, human nature imposes a certain degree of that approach, purely as a defense mechanism. Frankly, I see much less of that in this particular speech, than in most of the firebrands that get a public platform to speak from.

I thought he took considerable pain to show how he was drawn to his conclusions over the objections of his friends and family, and the culture he was born into and raised by. His moral stance is beyond mine, but then, I'm not a particularly moral person. At least I recognise that.

His conclusions are well-supported. And scary, because his theory goes a long way towards explaining so much of the decay of Western civilization in the last 40 years. And why radical Islam views us as decadent, evil, and worthy of destruction. Which turns the War on Terrorism into a domestic struggle for us as well.
Lordathestrings
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# 5
hunter60
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hunter60
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04/15/2007 4:37 pm
Originally Posted by: LordathestringsHis conclusions are well-supported. And scary, because his theory goes a long way towards explaining so much of the decay of Western civilization in the last 40 years. And why radical Islam views us as decadent, evil, and worthy of destruction. Which turns the War on Terrorism into a domestic struggle for us as well.



I can't really disagree with this. Like a sargent of mine always said when I was in the service "Wear a helmet and a cup. Bring a lunch boys, looks like we're going to be here all day!"
[FONT=Tahoma]"All I can do is be me ... whoever that is". Bob Dylan [/FONT]
# 6
Lordathestrings
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Lordathestrings
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04/15/2007 4:49 pm
Originally Posted by: hunter60.... "Wear a helmet and a cup. Bring a lunch boys, looks like we're going to be here all day!"

The man's got prespective! :cool:
Lordathestrings
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# 7
da_ardvark
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da_ardvark
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04/16/2007 4:58 pm
My 2 cents re: Imus

1. He certainly had a right to say what he did.
2. People also have a right to react to said statment in any manner they choose.
3. This was a non issue until Jackson and Sharpton along with the media made it one. Without each of these three, I bet the Rutgers team would never have heard/thought much about it.
4. The networks who employed Imus are/were well within their right to fire him.
5. Their explaination for the firing (We had internal meetings and decided that it was injurious to our other employees etc.etc) was total BS. The firings were a result of sponsers droppping their ad $$$.
# 8

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