Why a stack?

I always wondered whats the advantage of buying a big stack when you can mic a 50W amp and make it as loud as you would need to play any club? just wondering (I hope this doesnt come off as condesending)

It's all in tone differences. Listen to the distortion of a 50W amp mic'd, and then compare it say, a Crate Blue Voodoo stack, or a Marshall stack, or Mesa Boogie, etc. You'll hear the difference (because believe me, if there wasn't a difference, then everyone would just route little amps through a PA system - it'd be a helluva lot easier to lug around equipment then).

I would have to disagree that you get better tone from a stack vs. a small amp. In fact, there have been several discussions on this forum about how a lot of famous guitarists will have their rig go through a small miked amp, and then have a lot of dummy Marshall stacks on stage.

As with many things in rock 'n roll, it's all about looking cool.

Hmm, its possible. But when they say small they probably mean one or two half stacks miked and then played through a PA system. Not a crappy 10w amp.It would just sound like a load of noise if it was !

Nope, they meant a small, pignose amp. Small enough to play in your bedroom. Do a search in this forum for "wee beastie" or something like that. Either that, or somehow lure Lordathestrings into ranting about how smaller amps sound better than larger ones.

Well then theres three options...

A - 10 watt amp
B - 100 watt stack
C - 10 watt amp with $1000s of rack mounted equipment

For the best tone and sheer depth to your sound then you gota have a stack. And even a full stack where possible. Ive had every size of marshall going, and the full stack is simply awesome, even my pals $100 dollar guitar sounds half decent through it.

Yea in theory it would be better to have a 1watt amp driven harder than a 100watt one driven less but unless you have the rackmounted equipment to go with this hypothetical 1 watt amp then it aint gona work.

Its true though that most guitarists dont use say there marshall heads for example, they might use the rackmounted ones, or just use the clean channel of the amp and then get the distortion from rack equipment.

In that case thought the stack is the cheapest best option.

Currently I use a very small amp. A Peavey Rage, and I run my guitar through a Digitech RP200, then I mic the amp and I go through a PA system - that's my church rig.

For clubs, I go from my guitar, through the RP200, then to my Peavey KB/A. Yeah, I know, an electric guitar through an acoustic and keyboard amplifier? It works, and I like the sound - plus that baby can fill an auditorium with sound.

Who's the artist who uses a small mic'ed amp on stage? I know Brian May uses a small amp but he only uses it to overdrive the 12 AC30s on stage. If he's using a small amp, it had to be a good sounding, good quality, and powerful lil sucker. I haven't heard of a good 10 watt amp that you can have any good use outside either as a practice amp or an overdriving device. But if there is, its a good idea to try. It'd save me a lot man power, car space, and money from renting them stacks when I do gigs.

The Dirt

What do you think of using effects unit like a Korg AX 1500g together with a small amp on stage? Would the effects sound different in a mic'ed small amp than one plugged on a stack? When you plug in the effects, do you plug it on the clean channel by any chance? I haven't personally tried giging with an effects unit on small amps but when I get my chance, I'll give it a try on my next show.

I love pluggin my hollowbody electric to an acoustic amp. Even before I started having them piezo saddles, I was already using them acoustic amps too, especially the ones with a built- in chorus. I mostly use it for rythm work, I like the little bit of dimension it adds to the sound, especially my guitar's a hollowbody so its a bit acoustic there.

Sorry guys I dont mean anything like a 10W I was thinging of something you can use in a club like a 50-100W amp. If its a good amp is there a difference?

Of course if you really drive a 10W amp its probibly gonna sound crap, right

Originally posted by the fool
Who's the artist who uses a small mic'ed amp on stage? I know Brian May uses a small amp but he only uses it to overdrive the 12 AC30s on stage. If he's using a small amp, it had to be a good sounding, good quality, and powerful lil sucker. I haven't heard of a good 10 watt amp that you can have any good use outside either as a practice amp or an overdriving device. But if there is, its a good idea to try. It'd save me a lot man power, car space, and money from renting them stacks when I do gigs.

Here's some reading material (some are real blasts from the past!)

Click here

Here's where Lordathestrings really lets it rip - a must read!

It all seems to have started here

Theres all the evidence you need then to use a big amp, listen to brain mays guitar tone, yuck!

You do NOT need a big amp to get a good sound, NOR do you need all sorts of rack gear to make a small amp sound good.
A good sound is a good sound, doesn't matte how loud it is or how many speakers are being driven. In the process, usually only 1 or 2 drivers will be mic'ed, and you'll be brought back to line level no matter how loud you amp is, and then amplified through the P.A. system... then why would you need an excessive amount of power and drivers?

Since in live situations you want the backline to be as quiet as possible in order to avoid phase problems with the P.a., what you want is a low wattage amp. Thing with low wattage tube amps is that they reach their "sweet spot" of tone at much lower volume levels than big stack heads... which makes them much more suitable for live use than big stacks.
And yes, there ARE amps like that out there that sounds great at low levels, but I think many guitarists prefer not to believe it because a big stack just looks much cooler...

Originally posted by the fool
The Dirt
What do you think of using effects unit like a Korg AX 1500g together with a small amp on stage? Would the effects sound different in a mic'ed small amp than one plugged on a stack? When you plug in the effects, do you plug it on the clean channel by any chance? I haven't personally tried giging with an effects unit on small amps but when I get my chance, I'll give it a try on my next show.

Absolutely, I go from my guitar through my effects unit, through the CLEAN channel on my amp. I do not suggest using an amp's distortion in combination with effects units that simulate distortion. That can get plain nasty. I'm not familiar with the Korg effects unit, but running that through a small amp and mic'ing it through a PA system would be a great idea - that's what I do at church.

As for my bigger amp, it doesn't have a distortion channel! It's a keyboard amp. I go from the guitar to the RP200 (which I love... the presets suck, but you can make your own holy grail of tone with some work) to the amp.

You need stage volume...bottomline.If the house P.A sucks(or yours)then You might have to rely on your amp for stage volume...and no 15watt amp would cover that.If there are decent monitors,then you could get away with a nice sounding low-watt amp.

The chest pounding punch that roars out of good stacks is impossible from 1x12.4 to 8 12's push major air.

Tube amps usually sound there best at high volumes,so a low watt tube amp can attain a great sound at a much lower volume.Solid states happen to sound good at most any volume.If you dont want to lug a big stack,then a 2x12 is fine,and if your sure theres enough monitors you could bring a real sweet practice amp...the stage volume and tone will suffer though.

If I'm listening to a song on an album,the chest thump from 4x12 cabs dosn't have any relevance.
It also amazes me that so many people dont know to turn there stack or combo towards the drummer instead of facing the crowd.The audience really dosnt hear your stack.They hear it pumped in the P.A...theres no need to turn it at the audience,although,if you have a wall of 4x12/2x12 cabs,then it wouldnt matter much.

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Quote by Axl_rose

Theres all the evidence you need then to use a big amp, listen to brain mays guitar tone, yuck!

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Actually brian may doesnt just use that one amp. He uses 12 AC30s. He just uses the deacy amp to overdrive them. That's how he gets those violin sounds. I have the Vox Brian May amp which is a copy of his deacy amp. It sucks when i play it by itself; but when I use to overdrive my tube amps with it, i get an amazing sound- especially if i turn the treble booster on. It just sounds so full and natural- its also clean distortion too. The moment I got it, I don't need to use my distortion effects pedals any longer.

Although I am a very big Brian May fan, I will not be offended by that comment. Fortunately, everyone's entitled to have their own opinion. You can hate Brian May. You can even hate me for respecting him. But remember. I'm also entitled to the same privileges :) That's what so great about this damn country! Everyone's entitled to have their own opinions without getting persecuted.

... and may I add, axl_rose don't take it personally what I just said. I personally don't hate you. I just think you're sadly misinformed.

"sadly misinformed"!?!? Dont realy care for Brian May... his guitar sounds like a Kazoo!

Stacks have a 4x12 closed back speaker cabinet pushing allot of air.This makes a good sound if thats what your after.Its a bigger tighter sound with more power and punch.The disadvantage is there is not any places big enough to crank a 100watt Marshall.Back in the days of Jimi and his cranked 100watt plexis,was also the days of tiny PAs and stage volume.Allot of guys think the pros are cranking there amps on stage,um no.I played concerts befor and a 50watt Marshall on 5 is plenty loud for a small theatre,7 is bordering taking control from the sound man.
On the other hand running a say,30w tube amp on stage with say 2 12s has its advantage too cause in most concert venues you can crank the little basterd on 10 and drive the power tubes into orbit.
What makes the differance between the 2 is the cabinets a 4x12 closed back cab simply pushs more air making a tighter,in your face sound.
Also the diferance in wattage makes a differance too.You can crank a 30watt amp and get full bore power tube saturation.But on the other hand a 100watt Marshall can't be cranked in most places but but has an inherant fullness that the little amps just can't give.A/B a 50watt Marshall to a 100w Marshall and you'll hear a bigg differance in body.

Truthfully all they are in my opinion are stage dressing. Back in the cockrock days of hair, you had to have at least 3 full stacks on stage in order to even get laid after a gig... Of course, I had 3 full Soldano snakeskin-covered stacks, a large rack of effects with a midi pedal, so my setup was pretty impressive.... except what everyone didn't know was that the stacks on stage didn't work. the lights on the stacks lit up with a 9 volt battery. All my sound came from the little Boogie amp I had mic'ed offstage. I had killer sound and a great tone...and I didn't have to break my back lugging hundreds of pounds of loaded amps around after a gig.

So no, a stack isn't going to make a damn bit of difference against a small combo amp when you got monitors and a good PA.