Knocking on heavens Door


martjor854
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Posts: 99
martjor854
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Joined: 05/09/21
Posts: 99
08/24/2021 5:15 pm

Hi Mike,

I'm slightly confused,

is this the song structure

knocking on heavens door

Intro

G D Am Am7.

G D C Intro played twice

then onto Chorus x2

G D Am Am7

GDC

then verse 2 which is the same as the chorus played twice

then

chorus 2. Which is the same as chorus 1

is this played three times ?[br]then

outro

G D Am Am7 to fade

could the following strumming pattern also be used throughout this song

DDUUDU

can Imjust confirm the tempo of the song please.

[br]your guitar had a black background so it was hard to see the treble strings

At present

I am working my way through Fundamentals 1but have been studying guitar for the past two years.

I am enjoying the easier version of

It must have been love by Roxette.

very interesting series of lessons.

Thank for your valuable time.


# 1
Mike Olekshy
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Joined: 09/21/10
Posts: 1,045
Mike Olekshy
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Joined: 09/21/10
Posts: 1,045
08/25/2021 2:46 pm

Hi Martin,

The struming pattern I would use is D D DUDU so that the timing works out. This is a 16th note strumming pattern, which means the first 2 downstrokes are 1 and the and-of-1 (2 strums per beat), while thet next DUDU are 2-e-and-a (4 strums per beat). Then you repeat that strum pattern for the next 2 beats in the bar (3 and 4).

The tempo of the song is 69 bpm.

Hope this helps - let me know how it goes!

Mike

Originally Posted by: martjor854

Hi Mike,

I'm slightly confused,

is this the song structure

knocking on heavens door

Intro

G D Am Am7.

G D C Intro played twice

then onto Chorus x2

G D Am Am7

GDC

then verse 2 which is the same as the chorus played twice

then

chorus 2. Which is the same as chorus 1

is this played three times ?[br]then

outro

G D Am Am7 to fade

could the following strumming pattern also be used throughout this song

DDUUDU

can Imjust confirm the tempo of the song please.

[br]your guitar had a black background so it was hard to see the treble strings

At present

I am working my way through Fundamentals 1but have been studying guitar for the past two years.

I am enjoying the easier version of

It must have been love by Roxette.

very interesting series of lessons.

Thank for your valuable time.


Keep rockin!
Mike Olekshy
GT Guitar Coach

# 2
martjor854
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Joined: 05/09/21
Posts: 99
martjor854
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Posts: 99
08/31/2021 7:05 pm

Hi Mike,

I am still confused about the 16 note strum pattern and song structure.

could you write out the pattern with the chords please.


# 3
Mike Olekshy
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Joined: 09/21/10
Posts: 1,045
Mike Olekshy
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Posts: 1,045
09/02/2021 2:14 pm

This particular pattern goes like this:

Downstroke on the 1st beat.

Downstroke on the and-of-1.

Downstroke on the 2nd beat

Upstroke on the e-of-2.

Downstroke on the and-of-2.

Upstroke on the a-of-2.

(D D DUDU)

Then repeat the same pattern for beats 3 and 4.

Make sense? Let me know how it goes!

Mike

Originally Posted by: martjor854

Hi Mike,

I am still confused about the 16 note strum pattern and song structure.

could you write out the pattern with the chords please.


Keep rockin!
Mike Olekshy
GT Guitar Coach

# 4
martjor854
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Joined: 05/09/21
Posts: 99
martjor854
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Posts: 99
09/02/2021 4:29 pm

[br]sorry Mike, still confused as to how the 16th note pattern fits the chords

This is what I think each chord should be like, thanks


# 5
Mike Olekshy
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Posts: 1,045
Mike Olekshy
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Posts: 1,045
09/02/2021 5:37 pm

Hello - sorry this is so confusing.

For each measure (or bar) the strum is this:

1 and 2-e-and-a 3 and 4-e-and-a

OR

D D DUDUD D DUDU

G is strummed over the 1 and 2, D is strummed over the 3 and 4.

THEN

Am is strummed over the 1 and 2, and Am7 is strummed over the 3 and 4.

Then it repeats, except you don't go to Am, you'll go to C and it will be:

C is strummed over the 1, 2, 3, and 4.

Make sense?

Mike

Originally Posted by: martjor854

[br]sorry Mike, still confused as to how the 16th note pattern fits the chords

This is what I think each chord should be like, thanks


Keep rockin!
Mike Olekshy
GT Guitar Coach

# 6
martjor854
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Posts: 99
martjor854
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Posts: 99
10/04/2021 10:05 pm

Hi mike

I don't understand the way you are explaining this pattern in any of your replies.

can you set out the song structure for

knocking on heavens door.

how each chord is played in terms of the 16th note pattern , please.

I thought with this pattern they each chord had 16 strums.

is each chord played as follows but this only adds up to 12 strums

D D. D U D U. D. D. D u. D. U. =. 12 strums per chord. ??

1 and 2 e. And a. 3 and 4 e and a


# 7
martjor854
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Posts: 99
martjor854
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Posts: 99
10/04/2021 10:47 pm

Mike

I was taught that 16 note pattern is counted as follows

1e and a 2e and a 3e and a 4 e and a = 16 beats per pattern

you count it as

1 and 2e and a 3 and 4 e and a

knocking on heavens door acoustic guitar only

my Question is in Dylan's song hiw is this pattern applied to each chord

thanks


# 8
dlwalke
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dlwalke
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Posts: 240
10/05/2021 6:48 am
Originally Posted by: martjor854

Mike

I was taught that 16 note pattern is counted as follows

1e and a 2e and a 3e and a 4 e and a = 16 beats per pattern

you count it as

1 and 2e and a 3 and 4 e and a

knocking on heavens door acoustic guitar only

my Question is in Dylan's song hiw is this pattern applied to each chord

thanks

You are correct in that 16th note patterns are most often counted using 1-e-and-a, 2-e-and-a, etc. It looks like Mike was just showing the strums (and omitting the counts for the chords that don't get strummed) but you can still say them in your head. So in the sequence G-D-Am-Am7, you don't strum a chord on each 16th note. There are 4 16th notes for which a chord is not sounded, so you end up playing 12 chords during that sequence. I haven't looked at the lesson but it seemed to me that Mike was saying the strum pattern is

1-e-and-a [strum G on "1" & "and'; so D-(skip)-D-(skip)]

2-e-and-a [strum D on on all 4; so D-U-D-U]

3-e-and-a [strum Am on "1" & "and'; so D-(skip)-D-(skip)]

4-e-and-a [strum Am7 on on all 4; so D-U-D-U]

By the way, usually when I learn a song, I google it and find several lessons. I find getting the same or similar info from different sources can be helpful. Often, they're not exactly the same (maybe someone is teaching it exact, another person is teaching a slightly simplified version, someone else just hears it a bit different) so I'll see what I think about the options and maybe mix and match and add a little of my own flair. There's a bunch of "Knockin on Heaven's Door" lessons.

Also, I know at least one instructor here (Dave Celetano - who has a forum) offers zoom lessons. Not sure what the pricing is but if you are struggling with something and think some real-time interactive instruction would be helpful, you could contact him. I think you can do just a single lesson if that's what you need.


# 9
Mike Olekshy
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Joined: 09/21/10
Posts: 1,045
Mike Olekshy
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Posts: 1,045
10/05/2021 3:17 pm

Hello Martin - thanks to dlwalke for chiming in here with more explanation.

When we say it's a "sixteenth note" strum, that doesn't mean we strum every subdivision. All it means is that we've divided the beat into 16th notes. So there are 4 subdivisions per quarter note.

I apologize for not being more clear, but dlwalke has the correct, more thorough explanation.

If you think of each quarter note, there are 4 subdvisions (1 - e - and - a). Each subdvision gets assigned a strum. So the motion of your strumming arm will be Down Up Down Up. That doesn't mean you're striking the strings each time.

For example - when I said DD (down, down) -- it means to strike the strings on the "1" and the "and" but the upstrokes do not strike the strings there.

Does this make sense? Let me know!

Mike


Keep rockin!
Mike Olekshy
GT Guitar Coach

# 10
martjor854
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Joined: 05/09/21
Posts: 99
martjor854
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Posts: 99
10/05/2021 10:34 pm

Thanks guys,

I will be playing this song with an Acoustic guitar.

watched Guitar 1 Acoustic lesson and lesson for single guitar with track.

understand previous explanation.

I don't understand the following

G major

DD- DUDU

Why is the DUDU added to the G Major if only two downstrums sound

then goes to D major

DUDU ghost downstrum then UU

I understand that G and D sound twelve chords

According to this I understand that this means G is strummed over 1 and 2?

I can understand the videos but this is extremely confusing with this arrangement


# 11
Mike Olekshy
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Joined: 09/21/10
Posts: 1,045
Mike Olekshy
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Joined: 09/21/10
Posts: 1,045
10/06/2021 1:12 pm

Here are the strums for G:[br][br]Beat 1 : D D (strums on "1" and "and")

On this first beat, the upstrokes are not striking the strings.

Beat 2 : DUDU (strums on "1" - "e" - "and" - "a" )

On this second beat, all strums are striking the strings.

Then you change to D on Beat 3.

Make sense?[br]Mike

Originally Posted by: martjor854

Thanks guys,

I will be playing this song with an Acoustic guitar.

watched Guitar 1 Acoustic lesson and lesson for single guitar with track.

understand previous explanation.

I don't understand the following

G major

DD- DUDU

Why is the DUDU added to the G Major if only two downstrums sound

then goes to D major

DUDU ghost downstrum then UU

I understand that G and D sound twelve chords

According to this I understand that this means G is strummed over 1 and 2?

I can understand the videos but this is extremely confusing with this arrangement


Keep rockin!
Mike Olekshy
GT Guitar Coach

# 12
martjor854
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Joined: 05/09/21
Posts: 99
martjor854
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Posts: 99
10/14/2021 8:28 pm

Hi Mike,

Thanks for your time. I have printed off some notation and applied the 16 note pattern

to the notation, I am not sure of the songs complete structure for the Acoustic guitar version of this song. I enjoyed watching the electric guitar version.

I have watched the Intro video lesson and looked at the notation:

I am interested in playing the Acoustic guitar basically on its own with the backing track.

Notation for Acoustic Guitar lesson 3 and video.

apologies for all the questions I just want to get this correct so that I can practice correctly.

please can you look over this ( from this lesson I have learnt that the 16th pattern can be played in different ways)

What confused me was the fact that in this lesson not every 16th chord note was sounded, with 4 not sounded.

Did you say repeat the pattern DD DUDU for Beats 3 and 4 have I must have got confused

this is when the D major chord comes in DUDUxUxU

please can you check the way I have set out the song I feel it is correct.

I think this is how the video and notation shows it also.

someone said on the forum that the pattern was

DD DUDUD DDUDU

1and 2e and A 3and 4eand A

the problem is that if we applied this to beat 3 and beat 4 it would be different to the notation and video. Just an observation.

I will set out exactly how I will Play the intro and other sections ( I think this is correct

if you could outline the full string structure, it repeats continually doesn't it)

beat 1 G major chord (played over Beats 1 and 2)these chords share bar 1

1 e and a 2eand a

D. D. DuDu. DD beat 1. DUDU beat 2

The D major chord starts on Beat 3

3. E and a 4 e and a

D.u. D. U U. U. This is how the D major is shown on notation and video

Only the e and the last a are used

DUDU used in 3eand a 4 eand a only uses the two upstrums

bar 2

in this bar Am and Am7 is introduced half ways through the bar

the

AM is strummed exactly the same as beat 1 shown in bar 1 the G maj chord

the Am7 added with the pinky on the G note with Am staying down

comes in at the 3e and a ( it is also played over the 4th beat

the Am7 is strummed exactly the same as the D major chord in beat 3 bar 1

Am7

DUDUxUxU

only the last two uostrums are used in the fourth beat exactly like the D major chord.

x means not played

bar 3

G major and D major share this bar in the same way as Bar 1

Played exactly the same as Bar 1

bar4

Cmajor chord for the whole bar

1eand a 2eand A 3eand a 4 e and a

Dx D. X DUDU

althiugh the notation shows C for whole bar the video shiws a C7 added

half way thru bar like the Am 7 was added in bar 2

C7[br]played over Beats 3 and 4

DUDU with the two upstrums on the 4eand a only used as with Am7

the verse is played as follows G D Am Am7. G D C with repeat : marks meaning it's played twice and played exactly the same ways as the chords mentioned above.

the Chorus is the same as the verse and played the same.

the intro

G D Am Am7 G D C

I thinks there are three verses in the song

[br]you said after Am somewhere the C major chord come in and is played over 1,2,3,4

Do you mean Beats 1,2,3,4 or chords G D shown in bar 1

Mike I deeply appreciate your time and thank you I know you have a lot of students.

Martin


# 13
Mike Olekshy
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Joined: 09/21/10
Posts: 1,045
Mike Olekshy
Guitar Tricks Instructor
Joined: 09/21/10
Posts: 1,045
10/15/2021 1:06 pm

Hi Martin! As for the song structure, it repeats the same chord progression all the way through - G D Am Am7 then G D C.

You have correctly worked out the strum pattern which is the same for every bar:

D D DUDUDUDU U U

For the C chord - on beats 3 and 4 - I'm adding a higher G note to the chord (3rd fret of the 1st string). This does NOT change the chord to C7 - it still remains a C major chord, just a slightly different voicing.

Hopefully this covers your questions! Once again, I'm sorry for all the confusion!

Now that you are clear on the strum pattern and chord changes, the best way to work through this is to slow the performance video down (using the speed buttons on the left side of the video frame), and do your best to match your playing along with the instructor.

Good luck and let me know how it goes!

Mike

Originally Posted by: martjor854

Hi Mike,

Thanks for your time. I have printed off some notation and applied the 16 note pattern

to the notation, I am not sure of the songs complete structure for the Acoustic guitar version of this song. I enjoyed watching the electric guitar version.

I have watched the Intro video lesson and looked at the notation:

I am interested in playing the Acoustic guitar basically on its own with the backing track.

Notation for Acoustic Guitar lesson 3 and video.

apologies for all the questions I just want to get this correct so that I can practice correctly.

please can you look over this ( from this lesson I have learnt that the 16th pattern can be played in different ways)

What confused me was the fact that in this lesson not every 16th chord note was sounded, with 4 not sounded.

Did you say repeat the pattern DD DUDU for Beats 3 and 4 have I must have got confused

this is when the D major chord comes in DUDUxUxU

please can you check the way I have set out the song I feel it is correct.

I think this is how the video and notation shows it also.

someone said on the forum that the pattern was

DD DUDUD DDUDU

1and 2e and A 3and 4eand A

the problem is that if we applied this to beat 3 and beat 4 it would be different to the notation and video. Just an observation.

I will set out exactly how I will Play the intro and other sections ( I think this is correct

if you could outline the full string structure, it repeats continually doesn't it)

beat 1 G major chord (played over Beats 1 and 2)these chords share bar 1

1 e and a 2eand a

D. D. DuDu. DD beat 1. DUDU beat 2

The D major chord starts on Beat 3

3. E and a 4 e and a

D.u. D. U U. U. This is how the D major is shown on notation and video

Only the e and the last a are used

DUDU used in 3eand a 4 eand a only uses the two upstrums

bar 2

in this bar Am and Am7 is introduced half ways through the bar

the

AM is strummed exactly the same as beat 1 shown in bar 1 the G maj chord

the Am7 added with the pinky on the G note with Am staying down

comes in at the 3e and a ( it is also played over the 4th beat

the Am7 is strummed exactly the same as the D major chord in beat 3 bar 1

Am7

DUDUxUxU

only the last two uostrums are used in the fourth beat exactly like the D major chord.

x means not played

bar 3

G major and D major share this bar in the same way as Bar 1

Played exactly the same as Bar 1

bar4

Cmajor chord for the whole bar

1eand a 2eand A 3eand a 4 e and a

Dx D. X DUDU

althiugh the notation shows C for whole bar the video shiws a C7 added

half way thru bar like the Am 7 was added in bar 2

C7[br]played over Beats 3 and 4

DUDU with the two upstrums on the 4eand a only used as with Am7

the verse is played as follows G D Am Am7. G D C with repeat : marks meaning it's played twice and played exactly the same ways as the chords mentioned above.

the Chorus is the same as the verse and played the same.

the intro

G D Am Am7 G D C

I thinks there are three verses in the song

[br]you said after Am somewhere the C major chord come in and is played over 1,2,3,4

Do you mean Beats 1,2,3,4 or chords G D shown in bar 1

Mike I deeply appreciate your time and thank you I know you have a lot of students.

Martin


Keep rockin!
Mike Olekshy
GT Guitar Coach

# 14

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