The Annoying G String

Hio

I always have trouble with my G-String not being able to be tuned. Every time the string is being tuned, it must be getting stuck in the nut because the pitch doesn't change then suddenly there is a little twang noise and the string is higher in pitch than I need it to be. Then I tune down towards the open G note again and changes pitch till I get to the right tuning. I start to play and I find that it has already gone flat and the cycle starts again.

The other problem I am having with the string is that when I play an open note, the string is "roughly" in tune but when I play the note on the 2nd fret, the A note being played is sharp by about half a step. I have tried setting the intonation but the saddles on my SG will not go back far enough to set the intonation correctly. Is it possible that the strings I have chosen are too light for this model of guitar? and consequently the intonation can't be set for strings so light?

I have been forced to tune the string to the open G note, then tune it to the 2nd fret A note. When I play the open G note, it's flat but it doesn't sound that bad and when I play the 2nd fret A note, it is still a little sharp (because I didn't tune it exactly) but doesn't sound that bad either. Still.. the guitar is technically out of tune.

What's going on?

Hello Light 487,

Hey, over the years, I have had the very same problems you describe. First about the strings not tuning properly. After trying many different combinations, guages and brands of strings, I finally have found what works for me the best.

In the past, to fix the problem you describe with the G not tuning properly, I used a wound G string...like about a .20 or a .22 guage string. I used this for many years and it worked fine but of course it makes it harder to bend the string much beyond one fret. Finally I discovered Elixir brand strings for electric guitar. I now use their medium guage set, 12102 .011, .014, .018, .028w, .038w and .049w. I have found that the heavier guage 0.18 G string stays in tune better and intonates properly. The tone is excellent and since these strings have the special rust inhibiting coating, they last 3 to 5 times longer than other strings. I am quite pleased with these strings. By the way, I don't work for Elixir!

As far as the strings not moving as the tuning machines are turned until you hear a "snap" and then the string goes beyond the note you wanted, it sounds to me like the channels cut into the nut where the strings lay are not wide enough to accommodate the strings and so they "grab" in the channels. The nut is too tight. Be wary...I wouldn't work on the nut of a guitar unless you know exactly what you are doing and are experienced. There is nothing easier to mess up than the nut of a guitar. I would take the guitar to a reputable music shop or music store. Many stores have guitar technicians right in the store. If not, they can recommend someone in your area that is a reputable guitar repairman. A Gibson SG is a a fine instrument. I cannot imagine that it can't be set up properly so that you can get these problems behind you.

I hope this helps. Best wishes,

Bobby Howe

Originally Posted by: guitargeorge50Hey, over the years, I have had the very same problems you describe. First about the strings not tuning properly. After trying many different combinations, guages and brands of strings, I finally have found what works for me the best.

In the past, to fix the problem you describe with the G not tuning properly, I used a wound G string...like about a .20 or a .22 guage string. I used this for many years and it worked fine but of course it makes it harder to bend the string much beyond one fret. Finally I discovered Elixir brand strings for electric guitar. I now use their medium guage set, 12102 .011, .014, .018, .028w, .038w and .049w. I have found that the heavier guage 0.18 G string stays in tune better and intonates properly. The tone is excellent and since these strings have the special rust inhibiting coating, they last 3 to 5 times longer than other strings. I am quite pleased with these strings. By the way, I don't work for Elixir!

YAY! Someone who understands my problem! ;)

Yeh.. I have been trying out all different things too but I have never tried Elixir strings before.. I just usually buy the same brand I've always bought for 15+ years... I have heard other people mentioning these strings before about them being a little more pricey than other strings but if it has a chance of fixing the problem, I will give it a shot...

As far as the strings not moving as the tuning machines are turned until you hear a "snap" and then the string goes beyond the note you wanted, it sounds to me like the channels cut into the nut where the strings lay are not wide enough to accommodate the strings and so they "grab" in the channels. The nut is too tight.

I was thinking may be putting some graphite dust in there first but if that doesn't do the trick I will certainly take it to my guitar repairman. I think though that having that particular gauge strings might help enough to get the guitar back in action..

Luckily I fixed a similar issue with my strat by changing the D string with a wound string, so I was able to get it back into action for my thing earlier today..

And what about intonation.. this is not a problem only found on my SG but also on my strat... I find that the saddles can not go far enough away from the fret board to allow the 12fth fret note to be the same note (albeit one octave higher) as the open string. I play as lightly as I can on the 12fth fret so that additional pressure on the fretted string does not make it even sharper than it already is..

You mention having a much thicker gauge than I currently have on my strat (I have .09 to .46 on strat for example) and that that particular gauge intonates correctly.. I thought the point of having these saddles was to allow for almost all gauge to work with the guitar.. but now I am wondering whether some models of guitar can only really handle a specific range of gauges.. like my SG may only be capable of gauges of around .11 to .52 whereas the strat might be a little lighter, say 0.10 to 0.46, rather than as light as I have 0.09 to 0.46.

Noone ever mentions, in their intonation tutorials, what to do if your saddle reaches one side of the bridge (or the other) and the 12fth fret note is still out of tune...making it seems as though I am doing something wrong.

I'll take a picture of my bridge with my phone to show you what I mean.. It seems as though if I continue to set the intonation (I have only set the first 3 strings) that they will all be at the far right (away from fret board) position and still wanting to go further. On all the tutorials, the movement of the saddles is minuscule in comparison.

About the Elixir strings...yes, they are a bit pricier than others, no question...but they last 3 to 5 times longer than the others. You know the old saying..."You get what you pay for!".

Since I've never owned an SG, I can't really speak about it too much except to say that I know it is a very fine instrument...I certainly have played a number of SG's that belonged to friends of mine. I have re-strung and intonated about 3 zillion guitars in my years of playing. :) OK, maybe only 2 zillion! :D But I have never seen a guitar that would not intonate properly with any standard set of guitar strings tuned to standard pitch.

The people who make guitars, i.e., the guitar manufacturing industry can't afford to make instruments that are weird and difficult to intonate. I would say that they go out of their way to make sure that that doesn't happen. All of this to say that any commercially manufactured guitar should be able to be intonated properly with any commercially manufactured standard set of guitar strings especially a quality instrument like an SG or a Strat.

Even going further, for many years I used what most players would consider a very unorthodox set of strings, (custom guaged selected from the individual strings box) and I could intonate my guitars properly with these custom guages.

A couple of thoughts occur to me about intonation problems.

Check the neck to make sure it is adjusted properly...just a slight bit of bow about half-way between the nut and bridge. If you know how to adjust the truss rod and it needs it, then go ahead. If you don't know how to adjust the truss rod, then take it to someone who does. If you put too much torque on the truss rod adjustment with a wrench (spanner) you can strip out the threads and ruin your guitar. Don't get too nasty with putting pressure on the truss rod. If you have to get real mean with it, there is something wrong with it. Take it to a guitar shop.

Now a couple of thought about the bridge. One thing...if the bridge has a Floyd Rose tremolo...all bets are off. I'm not a fan of them at all, I don't really see the usefulness of them and they are super-difficult to make work properly...if at all.

As far as the Strat is concerned, I own one as well. I really like everything about the guitar except for the tremolo. I bought the Strat with the complete intention of disabling the tremolo function right from the outset. By the way, notice that Eric Clapton doesn't have a tremolo arm on his Strat!

Let me say a couple of things about that. In my opinion (I know it might not be very popular) the Fender tremolo system is junk. The only tremolo system I've ever seen work properly is a Bigsby but they don't come on every guitar and they are pricey. They are pricey because to make a tremolo system work on a guitar it requires precision machining and a lot more thought and expense having been put into it than the cheesy Fender spring system. On my Fender, I blocked the tremolo system off...that is...I took the plastic plate off of the back of the guitar and put a small block of wood between the bridge and the body of the guitar. This is so that the strings will pull against the bridge and wedge the block of wood tightly against the body cavity and keep it in place properly. I guess it goes without saying that when you change your strings, if you take all of your strings off at the same time, there would be no tension on the bridge against the block of wood and so it could move around and get out of place. With the plastic plate back in place, no one else will know you have put a block of wood inside the body cavity unless you tell them or they ask you where your tremolo arm is.

Goodbye Fender tremolo and goodbye to tuning problems.

In my opinion, whatever benefit one might possibly get from having a Fender Strat with a (functioning?) tremolo in place is greatly offset by the even greater benefit of having a guitar that stays in tune.

I certainly have gone on and on here. I hope this helps and forgive me for talking too much!

Best,

Bobby

Hey, I forgot to mention one thing. After reading a bit more about your problem on the Strat and after going on and on as I did about my Strat, I forgot to mention that it seems that you are working against a bridge that has moved as you are trying to intonate your guitar. The tremolo springs are not holding the bridge steady so the tension from the strings is pulling the bridge up off of the guitar such that you cannot intonate it. If the bridge of the guitar "raises up" from it's normally fixed position as a result of the strings pulling one way and the tremolo springs pulling the other way, the tremolo springs are weak and not able to hold the bridge down to the proper place it should be when trying to intonate. I think I am correct when I say that the end result will be your saddles don't seem to go far enough away from the nut to bring the strings back into pitch.

Let's say that you could intonate a string properly on your guitar. Now, all of a sudden, the length of the string is made shorter (the bridge has moved--"raised up"). The string now is shorter so if you re-tune to the note desired, then play the harmonic at the 12th fret, the harmonic should be sharp, i.e., the string needs to be made longer either by adjustment of the saddle, (you indicate that there is no more adjustment) or by getting the bridge to "lay back down" to where it was originally.

I'm pretty sure I'm correct about this and I hope it helps. Let me know how it goes.

Bobby

Hey, I mentioned elsewhere about the fine grit sandpaper and carefully using a piece of it folded in half to pull through the grooves in the nut to widen them so that strings don't bind up in there. If this is done properly, It will allow the strings to move freely in the nut and make the guitar tune smoothly.

Working on the nut of a guitar should be done with great care, not casually. If you are careful and only use the smallest amount of adjustment necessary, you can achieve acceptable results. Keep two things in mind, 1. A little goes a long way and 2. Remember, string guages are measured in thousandths.

Here is another thing about Fender or similar guitars which use "string trees" between the nut and the tuning machines. These string trees are notorious for causing strings to bind and therefore not tune properly. I've seen two types of string trees for Fenders, basically a cheap one and a more high end one on their top of the line guitars. I own a Fender Strat and it has the lower end string trees for the high E and B strings. The string trees gave me problems with binding so I don't even use them at all. I totally bypass them and take the strings from the nut straight to the tuning machines.

Two things I forgot to mention are these: 1. Before drawing sandpaper through the grooves in the nut, be aware that the sandpaper will act on other things it may touch, i.e., the frets, the headstock, etc. so use it very carefully. You may even want to mask off parts of the guitar that might get in the way with heavy paper and tape. 2. Remember, the grooves in the nut have a bottom to them and so best results will be achieved if the sandpaper is drawn through the nut groove parallel to the bottom. You can get an idea of what the bottom of the nut groove looks like by looking at the nut from the side to see where the string enters and exits the nut.

I would only do this with the sandpaper one stroke at a time. Check between strokes by re-tightening and re-tuning the strings in question to see if the problem is getting any better. Remember, the objective is to have most of the abrasion take place on the sides of the nut grooves--not on the bottom of it. If the bottom of the nut groove is significantly altered, the string will lay closer to the neck and fretboard and may give undesirable results like buzzing of the strings at the first fret.

Another thing to try is silicone spray. A commercially made product for guitar players is called "Finger Ease". Most music stores carry it. Loosen the string or strings that are giving you a problem. Get a Q-tip cotton swab and soak the end down with the Finger Ease. Apply to the string at the point where it moves through the nut. Re-tighten the string and see if this doesn't help. Finger Ease wont' hurt your guitar or your guitar's finish.

I hope these items help.

BH