The Disception of Metal

Alright, I don't know what forum to put this in, feel free to move as needed. But anyways....

I talk with these real extreme metal heads that I used to work with. They've expressed hate for essentially every genre of music, aside from vocal chord breaking, drop tuned down to hell metal. I was talking about Black Label Society and Zakk Wylde one night. Apparently thats southern rock. One guy referred to the virtuosos as "extreme sports athletes." Obviously hes just ignorant and hasn't actually listened to Satch, Vai, or the rest of the gang who incorporates a lot of thought and feeling into their music. Just because they do it fast doesn't make it not musical.

About the only bands I've heard them express love for are Killswitch Engage, Unearth, and Dragonforce. Who all are of course metal or metalcore.

But it still boggles my mind. They don't even seem to appreciate the roots of their genre. Sabbath and Testament are classic rock. Metallica and Megadeth are crap.

One day Steve Vai's "Building the Church" came on the satellite radio and I told them what song it was and one guy replied "Steve Vai can build my balls."

Is there something I'm missing with metal? Does being a hardcore metal head mean you have to shun every other genre and style of music and pledge allegiance to Satan? I mean c'mon. Its all music in one form or another.

Those of you who consider yourselves metal heads, enlighten me on what you think metal is. I've heard multiple definitions, and some I'm sure couldn't give me an answer because they don't actually know or have an appreciation for the musical intervention within. Some just hop on the metal trains because of the image associated with it. But all of us being musicians here should have some insight.

Thoughts, comments?

Today's generation of music has divisions gapped so far apart that a young buck becoming exposed from the intensity pouring out from these bands, has nothing to compare it to. The more that become exposed to it, the more offspring it will produce until the sound gets burnt out. Then the next generation will produce a different sound, etc.............

So you think its a fad dvenetian? I agree with that to a certain extent. I mean, metal has evolved, thats for sure. But I think perhaps this metalcore thing may burn out with time.

people like that are not metalheads....if you give no creedence to black sabbath or maiden or priest ....well....your just a dumbass with B.O. and yellow teeth.

Originally Posted by: dvenetianThen the next generation will produce a different sound, etc.............

Thank you Lord....but i believe it is just kids trying to be tougher
than the last bunch of metalheads which is pretty infantile if you think about it...i'm just waiting for the infant sacrifices on stage......then i might get postal on them :mad:

Originally Posted by: z0s0_jppeople like that are not metalheads....if you give no creedence to black sabbath or maiden or priest ....well....your just a dumbass with B.O. and yellow teeth.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAH! I agree z0s0, gotta know where you came from.

Originally Posted by: z0s0_jpThank you Lord....but i believe it is just kids trying to be tougher
than the last bunch of metalheads which is pretty infantile if you think about it...i'm just waiting for the infant sacrifices on stage......then i might get postal on them :mad:

You probably won't see the "infant sacrificed bit" due to the fact that they would be considered a "copy-cat band" to "Gwar" who have done the grotesque act from "delivery through sacrifice" on stage years ago.
I personally don't understand how that pertains to music, but it must to some because they paid to see it.

i'm talking a real baby.

Originally Posted by: grizzlymintSo you think its a fad dvenetian? I agree with that to a certain extent. I mean, metal has evolved, thats for sure. But I think perhaps this metalcore thing may burn out with time.

The main reason that I believe the sound will eventually burn out is because of the limited boundary in tone it allows for guitar. Some bands are tuned down "as low as they can go" for conventional six string guitar design (even seven string for the most part). There's less room for creativity with limited sources in tone, so the more bands that use up what's available, eventually will have 3 out of 5 others sounding similar to them, until something changes or they create a new instrument.

Originally Posted by: z0s0_jpi'm talking a real baby.

Gwar looks real enough, at least from the picture I saw in the book "Heavy Metal".

Metal as music can be very interesting to listen to. It can evoke certain images and emotions. But metal's biggest problem is that in many peoples eyes, it slipped from being about the music to being about the lifestyle and sadly, as in so many cases, lifestyles are manufactured.

It's the same thing that killed the hipppie movement. Early on, the music was 'about' something. Then it was incorporated and became a Madison Avenue tool. It was manufactured and marketed. The same thing will happen, and is happening, to metal.

It's become 'associated' with things.

So bands coming up through the ranks now are trying to push that envelope even more. More outrageous acts, lyrics...etc.

On the plus side, metal will have it's re-birth again as a respectable music form like when Nirvana brought rock back from the abyss that was eighties synthie-pop.

Of course, I could be wrong. :)

I consider my self a metal head, but don't really dress like one. Its almost always a t-shirt (usually black, no reason, just cause most band shirts are) and jeans for me. But even though metal is my fav. genre and I go crazy at shows, I listen to all genre's of music. Just last nite I was listening to Chuck Mangione. A lot of the metal head kid's out there and hardcore kids only listen to music cause its a genre, they rate a band on how heavy they are, how good they're breakdowns are, and how good the vocalist can growl. They don't really appreciate the music. Whenever a solo comes in, they just see it as fast playing and become bored of it shortly after. I thinkthats why a lot of bands these days don't do full blown solo's (if any) cause the fans don't go for it. A lot of bands are changing so they fit it with whatever the current music fad is, right now its guys singing girlish vocals and it sucks.

I'm a proud metalhead, I enjoy any record from Metallica, MAchinehead, Slipknot, Pantera, Dino Cazares Asesino, Carcass, Arch Enemy... you name it.

I agree there are a lot of metal bands that talks crap of other styles

I've been reading guitar magazines and boys like Trivium have a concern for making good music and pay they respec to to bigger bands than they but dickheads like Dragonforce are the ones that always says the most stupid things.

You can play the tough guy... (slipknot stage show is brutal... I just love it), you can play as low and distorted as you want... but you have to have RESPECT. That's the keyword RESPECT.

You have to stand up for your stuff, but if no one attacked you.. why bother?

I'm a huge fan of (obviously) Satch, Vai, Petrucci, I enjoyed so much the Joe Bonamassa posting in the must see thread, I like very much jazz, and some electronic music, and classics... damn... Hendrix (it just makes me sad that the only thing he had to be recorded was a 4 track), Zeppellin, gosh... there's so much music to get a grip off and no kind is easy or less important than another, but I still love the hard sound of a wall of Double rectifiers tru heavy distortion.

Dude you need to stop reading guitar mags because they dont know anything about metal. You just named off some of the most over rated bands (Metallica Slipknot Trivium and Dragonforce). The guys in trivium cant even read sheet music and pretty much just copy metallica and pantera in all there songs, Metallica hasnt made a good album in a few thousand years, dragonforce cant play there crap live to save there lives and slipknot just sucks.

There is a total lack of musicianship in new metal bands, they just bask in the glory of Drop D tunings and 1 finger power chords. And then for vocals they just yell as loud as they can, I can give credit to the guys who have a really devilish growl like Muhhamed (sp?) Suicmez, and he can play a million times better then most new bands while growling.

I actually blame magazines for alot of this, they praise every new band like gods and then make guitar players (zakk wylde) seem way better than they are.

the song structure of numetal is irritating......i hear songs by i.e stone sour and staind that do the chorus like 30 times in 4 minutes....very lazy song writing i guess.

Originally Posted by: z0s0_jpthe song structure of numetal is irritating......i hear songs by i.e stone sour and staind that do the chorus like 30 times in 4 minutes....very lazy song writing i guess.

I wouldn't put Stone Sour in the same boat as Staind... Staind's Tormented and Dysfunction albums were some of the best stuff to come out of the 90's.... Since they they've written the same song over and over...

To me, Stone Sour is Slipknot for fans of real MUSIC... Corey Taylor is a great songwriter and some of the guitar work in some of there songs isn't too bad for a modern rock band.

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Now to the metal issue... There are two types of people that like metal. There are the musically enlightened and the non musically enlightened... The people that Grizzly is explain are obviously the non musically enlightened. Obviously everything comes down to personal preference. The guys you're describing either don't know how to play guitar or play guitar and aren't very good at it so they play in dropped tuning because all you have to do is be able to barre with your index finger. People that emerse themselves in music generally can appreciate all kinds of music. People fear what they don't understand... I compare Vai, Satch, Pettrucci, Eric Johnson, Malmsteen all to classical composers more than anything else... Not a lot of people can sit and listen to their music because they don't UNDERSTAND it. They don't understand how physically challanging and mentally challenging it is to write and compose the music that they compose... specifically Steve Vai's stuff... People that understand guitar as an instrument and not just a noise maker tend to grasp the understanding of the music... thus appreciate it for what it is.

With that I ask everyone out there to appreciate any music as music... Like Polansky said... you have to RESPECT it for what it is. A lot of times you get people out there that hate anything but super technical music because they think just because a song has 4 chords and no solos it's not good... I appreciate all kinds of music and I like a broad spectrum of music as well... just because I wear Abercrombie and Fitch doesn't mean I can't go to OzzFest and knock your ass out in a mosh pit... I think people that shut other types of music out are just trying to hide from what they con't intellectually understand.... It's all opinionated... To the guy that said "Steve Vai can build my balls".... I would have told him to learn to play that song from beginning to end... then maybe he can talk about what Steve Vai can and can't build............. Either that or I would have said "is that a desperate attempt to get Steve Vai to touch your genitalia??"

true about stone sour but the new tune on the radio (something about pain is sitting in your room all alone ...lasts forever) is the chorus repeated over and over and over....it is a good chorus but if you over do it, it can ruin it.

Originally Posted by: z0s0_jptrue about stone sour but the new tune on the radio (something about pain is sitting in your room all alone ...lasts forever) is the chorus repeated over and over and over....it is a good chorus but if you over do it, it can ruin it.

"Through Glass" I think is what it's called... and yeah... that's not even that great of a song compared to the rest of that album. Zzyzx Rd. is a MUUUCH better acoustic/piano song... it's got a decent solo in it too. I like "Come What(ever) May", "Reborn", and "30-30/150" too... pretty much that whole album is good.

I'm a metal head for the most part, but I like all styles except country, hip hop, and pop.....

Aschelman, great post up yonder there. I believe you put it into perspective very well.

On a side note, I can spell "deception" correctly, but I had a brain fart at the moment and can't seem to change the thread title...oh well.