what's the problem?

Right, lets see if I can word this eloquenlty.

I have been playing for close on 7 years, I am a gear head, and over that time I hace accumulated a fair amound of really nice gear...The probelm is, that it doesnt sound nearly as good as it should...and its not the gear, its me.

I find that I sound pretty much the same on every amp I try, I sound marginally better on better amps, but no where near as good as how other people sound on them. The thing is, you can always hear its me playing, which would be a good thing, were it not for the fact that me playing sounds harsh and abrupt.

I dont know what it is, my lead technique is not bad, my soloing is pretty good actually, and I am finally getting my sweep picking together, and sounding good.

I dont know what it is, there is some subtle aspect to my playing that just makes what I play sound slightly worse than when someone else plays the exact same thing...if you get my meaning?

I play with rather thick plectrums (1,5mm) and think this could have something to do with the problem...

can anyone suggest any techniques I can try to get my playing to sound more fluid, and to have more feel? maybe I should play softer? but I dont consider my pick technique to be hard...

I'm pretty sure this problem is lying in my right hand technique, so if anyone has any suggestions, please post away...I will try anything, so even if you think its not the solution, please post it anyway.

thanks guys.
Andrew

oh, and added to this problem is that I dont really know how to dial in a good tone from the equipment I have.

I sold my old amp last week, and the buyer (using my guitar and amp) twiddled the knobs a bit, and dialed in tones I never even knew it could make.
does anyone have any methods of getting a good tone...like any ways to set your eq etc?
(I am not asking for pre set values, but ways to set values I'd like, so procedures to find the tones I like.)

um.. if you and some other dude use the same guitar and same amp and same settings and same effects, and his playing sounds good compared to yours... then you've gotta fix the way you pick, or the way you fret or something. its not the gear, its you. you'll get better. don't blame the heavy pick because alot of shredders and stuff use heavy picks and they sound good. i use heavy picks too.

I can't help any more inless you record something..

I know that the problem lies in me...and the way in which I dial in a sound...

Originally Posted by: Andrew Sa
I dont know what it is, there is some subtle aspect to my playing that just makes what I play sound slightly worse than when someone else plays the exact same thing...if you get my meaning?

Yeah man - it's called the mind. I feel the exact same way as you whenever I play with another guitarist, and I think you'll find that this is the case for a good number of other players. We musicians are our own harshest critics (except, perhaps, for Ted Nugent :p), and we have a tendency to assume that the subtle differences in our playing styles are fundamental faults which we need to fix. More often than not, it seems, these differences are so subtle that we ourselves are the only ones who know that they're there!
Don't get me wrong, though - I'm not saying that you shouldn't try to improve. If there are aspects of your playing that you're not happy with them, see if you can try to work on them. Don't worry about them too much, though, is all I'm saying. :)

And I apologise if what I've said just now is patronising or you've heard it all before. :o

I know what you're saying, but thats not it, even my brother has commented on this...its not that I'm a bad guitarist...just something about my style makes me sound abrupt and harsh.

if anyone has any pick hand techniques, please send them along.

first, regarding your tone, can we get some more info? do you scoop all your mids out, and boost the treble? 'cause unless your just busting out pantera riffs, that will sound really thin and won't help your cause...

second, you obviously seem to believe that the problem lies in your picking hand (i'm assuming you're right handed) as you've mentioned it several times. so you have half the battle won, inasmuch as you know the problem. now its very difficult to propose specific solutions without being able to see you play, but i can suggest a general solution that works almost 100% of the time....


Slow down.


play through your scales, sweeps, exercises etc, but take the tempo waaay back, and just watch your picking hand. observe how you hold the pick. watch where your palm is sitting. do you tend to rest your pinky on the body? (i always recomend not doing this, i think it restricts movement, but some players find otherwise... its a bit style dependent). are you picking at exactly the same time as your fretting hand is hitting the note?


if you've been playing for 7 years, you should be able to be your own worst critic, but you need to play slowly and observe what you are doing in order to be able to make changes to your technique...

hope that helps

Big A,

Know how, and what you are going through. I have been playing 18 years. Went through the same situation for many years and only recently "learned" differently.

The truth--the problem lies with you. :confused: :( .

It's sort of like the concept of how we do not like the sound of our own voice recorded. We perceive the way "it should sound" vs. the way it "actually sounds".

This is an issue -- becuase the root (music pun) lies within us -- that the only really advice that will work for you is patience (IMO) and total self --awareness? or acceptance (I prefer the latter).

Until about 2 years ago I was obsessed (yes 16 years of playing) with sounding perfect in everything I played, practiced and like you --DID not like the way I played/sounded.

Then one day it snapped and I just..........played. Here is hopefully an inspirational tale that will help you shorten the time it took me.

Setting-- Guitar Center.

The luck (or muse) in this case was my 14 year old son, Alex, who I had been teaching for 4 years at the time.

I had been promising to take him to GC so he could play around with different electrics and acoustics. (He had since outgrown his juinor guitar and was ready for a full "man"sized one).

So we made a Saturday and spent a good 2 hours there playing different instruments. At first I was handing him different "types".

Heres an Ibanez, Heres a Jackson, Heres a Strat, so on so forth. He was very timid at playing -- 4 years of playing and he was only 14 at the time :confused: (WOULD HAVE KILLED TO HAVE HIS CHOPS BACK THEN or a guitar for that matter)-- and he was very embarrased and shy.

Well for some reason that day I littereally had no thought, or care, what so ever about how I played. I was just wanting to show him the difference of the guitars and how each is "sort of " designed for specific genres of music {I know you can play anything on any guitar etc. etc. } So it ended up with him walking around the store pointing out different guitars and me playing them at the nearest amp that was available using whatever settings , both clean and distorted.

Later as we drove home my son was saying that he totally amazed so on and so forth and he wished I would "play that way at home". He was amazed at how I "let loose" and wasn't just playing around "with the amp" like I do at home and "play the same boring stuff". Other praises, but those go to the grave with me.

I know he is my son and that is to be expected. But my son is one of those kids that are brutally honest. God bless him.

Long story short.

I had to step back, and after many questions, look at what he was saying, how I felt and what was going through my mind while I was playing.

I was able to realize that -- here is where you need to apply ME in the sentences.

I am the guitar player that I am.

I play a certain way.

After all of these years, and countless hours of different settings, effects (etc. forever and ever, to infinity and beyond) that if after all this time playing -- If I hadn't found what I have been searching for by that time maybe the problem wasn't the equipment but the way I perceived ( heard ) myself.

So I pulled out a bunch of old cassetes and listened to my "anthology" and recordeed some new things and listened to those.

I actually heard that overall all those years my "sound" was always there I just never listened for it.

**I noticed you are aware of all the different things-- different people play..., everyone sound different on the same.... etc. etc. So I will not bore you with all that. But I jus twant to pass along this

* Until you are able to "let go" of what you want to hear and listen to what you can do you will always feel you are not the player you want/should/could be. Music is freedom and/of expression and we all express things differently and with our own voice. Listen to the voice that is and has always been yours. *

There is more about how I chose the settings that work for amps and pedals, strings pics, that work for me "now" but I am sure I am pontificating, so.....

I'll get off my soapbox.

excellent point. i always consider myself to be the best guitarist in the world, when it comes to playing like me!

I know what you guys are saying...but thats only half the problem....


can anyone give me a method of dialing in a tone I like...which parameters do I set first? and in what order? stuff like that, before I have just turned knobs until it sounds ok...but never really set out to get the best sound out of my equipment

what sounds good to me may sound like crap for you. all i can say is research the tone settings and really know what they do, then you'll know, when something's wrong with your sound, exactly what to do to fix it.

Big A,

I'm going to have to spend some time on this but I should have at least 7 different settings for different genre's of tones for you to play with and suggestions on how to mess with them. Give me about an hour and I will have posted them for you.

I know what you are feeling and saying. Hang in there :p

Here Goes. :o

Here are 7 settings I stumbled across that I use for my Daddy-O that seem to work well and can create the same "sound" when used as amp settings( I have one of them I use as a "base" for all my amps). They cover some basic sounds/tones to at least provide a [U]foundation[/U] for you to experiment and eventually adjust to your preferences.


I will use the "clock method" to describe the settings.

60's Brit

Bass-- full/ 5 o'clock
Mid-- 3/4 3 o'clock
Treb--3/4 3 o'clock
OD/Gian (optional) Less than 1/2 11 o'clock

Rock Lead


Bass-- 1 o'clock (less than 1/2){you get the picture I wiil not post anymore}
Mid-- 1 o'clock
Treb-- 9 o'clock
OD/Gain (optional) full 5 o'clock

Texas Blues

Bass--3 o'clock
Mid-- 12 o'clock
Treb-- 11 o'clock
OD/Gain (optional) 12 o'clock

Mellow Jazz

Bass-- 1 o'clock
Mid-- 9 o'clock
Treb-- 12 o'clock
OD/Gain (optional) 9 o'clock

Country Twang

Bass-- 9 o'clock
Mid-- 5 o'clock
Treb-- 5 o'clock
OD/Gain (optional) 11 o'clock

Rock Crunch (scooped Mid)

Bass-- 12 o'clock
Mid-- 9 o'clock
Treb-- 12 o'clock
OD-- FUll BAYBEEE!!!!

T.C.O.B. (taking care of bussiness)

Bass--10 o'clock
Mid--12 o'clock
Treb--1 o'clock
OD/Gain (optional) 11 o'clock


Now. Down to the fine "tuning" or should I say "toning" :rolleyes:

These are suggestions, but each has a different "feel" to the tone. It can bring you closer to a certain genre and hopfully help you "dial" in your tone.

Adjust the knobs on your amp either dead on or as close too as possible for each suggested settings

** I suggest you record each different setting and listen to them later to decide which you like best before you do any tweaking. "Listen with fresh ears"--posted somewhere**

While playing in a certain setting and you feel you must adjust a knob on your amp please take note--

When you adjust/tweak the knobs on your amp in a "particular setting" DO NOT over compensate. If you move MORE than 1 1/2 number left or right you are adjusting too much.

The finer adjustments need to be done with your tone knob/knobs on your guitar.

I can get a bright single coil sound on a bridge humbucker with the tone knob alone, on Gibson, and a flick of the selector switch. I feel alot of guitarists do not really utilize their pickup "switches" and tone knobs enough (IMO) they rely too much on the amp to produce what they want the guitar to do. Remember you have a tone knob on the guitar as well and so on and so forth (this I guess would be another thread).

I remember seeing this next part wriiten somewhere recently and I am too lazy to provide a link (but not to lazy to type) and I agree/ it's your gear do what you want :cool: .

Once, after many hours of experimentation you have found the "tone" you like on your amp, scratch, pencil mark, take a pen --whatever and mark the "position" on your amp next to the knob. This way if you adjust anything later you will at least have a reference of what you liked in the past on and on and on.

Number them if you have more than one you like and you can always switch or adjust , even in a live situation, with ease.

I can't explain enough how much I know what you are going through, and in my humble experience/s this is a common "wall/roadblock/etc." that many guitarist face and can be a big problem in moving forward.

Sometimes we get too hung up on how we sound instead of what we are playing and we also forget that what we hear on a record or DVD has been [U]mixed by a professional and in a live situation it is a total different sound[/U].

These are just suggestions and please take them with a grain of salt. Take what you want leave the rest. I just hope that it helps in some small way to helping you find what your looking for.

I'll get of my soap box.

Good Luck and Rock On!!!

wow you spent alot of time putting all that together plus you had to go through the trouble of

:mad: -->"tone searching"<-- :mad:!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

*gasp*

so you get rep :)

Pure,

Thanks for the rep's.

Unfortunately I canot take any credit for this. Some of these settings are based upon Danelectros recommended settings for the Daddy-O Distortion Pedal. :(

I just spent hours playing around with them and really liked a what I heard and just waned to pass along -- I am hoping-- some "helpfull" information and save every one else many hours of jacking with stuff.

I just wish this thing called "the internet" was around when I started playing. The wealth of information is amazing!!!

Here's the trick to getting a nice jazz tone:

Turn the amp WAY up.
Turn the guitar down.
You also don't want full tone on the guitar either.
Use only the bridge pickup.

If you want like the ultimate shredder tone without any pedals and stuff,

get these:

Amp:
gain- 3-5 o' clock
treble- 1 o' clock
middle- 12 o' clock
bass- 2 o'clock

Guitar:
pickup- neck or middle
volume- 10/10
tone- 5/10

just remember to keep the EQ around 12 o' clock and never have full tone.

wow, thanks guys...I'll be sure to try those all out.
Jimmy, thanks mate, seems you spent a lot of time coming aup with, and working on, those tones...I really appreciate it...

I dont really do the rep point thing, not sure why, but never really got into it and all, but if I knew about it, I'd be sure to give you some.
thanks guys

Originally Posted by: Julian VickersHere's the trick to getting a nice jazz tone:

Turn the amp WAY up.
Turn the guitar down.
You also don't want full tone on the guitar either.
Use only the bridge pickup.

Hmm, I prefer the middle pickup - but then again, many jazz players don't have the luxury of a middle pickup.

Originally Posted by: Andrew Sawow, thanks guys...I'll be sure to try those all out.
Jimmy, thanks mate, seems you spent a lot of time coming aup with, and working on, those tones...I really appreciate it...

I dont really do the rep point thing, not sure why, but never really got into it and all, but if I knew about it, I'd be sure to give you some.
thanks guys

On the top right corner of the post there's a scale.