What do you think of black/death metal?

Well, fun to hear your opinions.. I think myself that the death/black that originally came from thrash (guess Death and Possessed were the bands that acctaully found black/death). The Norwegean (Norway something) black/death-wave with Mayhem, Immortal and Darkthrone is very, very bad music. Aswell with he plastic black/death like Cradle of Filth and Dimmu Borgir. Just feel very teenage-rebellion-which-is-supposed-to-terrify-your-parents.

But I really like other black/death, acctaully:

Opeth
In Flames (Old)
Edge of Sanity
Death (Chuck - RIP)
Dissection
Cannibal Corpse (very humerous, i like it)
Children of Bodom (perhaps another genré, I'm not sure
Entombed (Death 'n' Roll rules)

That's it..

It bugs me the way music journos and others feel thay have to pigeon hole music into loads of made-up sub-genres when in fact there's very little difference between them. Death metal, speed metal, thrash, black metal..all sounds the same to me. Anyway,whatever you choose to call it, it's not my bag at all. Never could stand Black Sabbath either.

I used to like that kind of music, but the growling and repetitive death and evil cliches got pretty old. Musically some bands are pretty decent, and you can tell there are alot of metalheads out there that pay attention to the music than some other genres. If they don't get caught up in the over-technicality of it. My idea is, if it's good music then I'll listen to it and I like a variety of music. Black metal, eh? Early CoF was ok but now they suck arse! BTW I think Rob Zombie is pretty cool man, even musically. White zombie was kick ass, his new stuff ok but alittle to dance-metal to say his breaking apart was a step ahead.

My biggest disappointment in music is when one band does something truly original, whether metal or whatever, a thousand other bands do the samething destroying the creativity and individuality of that music.

Originally posted by finger_cruncher
Moreover, my main concern with this type of music (and others as well) is that 99.9% of it is based on image and little talent. Whatever happened to just good ole' plain metal (i.e. early Metallica)? These black/death metal bands would rather spend their time practicing evil looks in front of a mirror than sitting down and creating good music.

That's an arrogant and ignorant statement. If you were trying to express your personal opinion here, you failed miserably, because all I see are blanket statements.

I'm personally offended because I used to play in a death metal band and was involved in the underground scene quite a bit. Image was truly the last thing those guys care about, they have nobody to impress... Talent, well, who needs talent when you're more concerned about having fun at what you're doing? Isn't that what music is all about in the first place? And practising evil looks? That's probably the funniest thing I've read in quite a long time... When it comes to creating good music, that can be a very subjective thing. It sounds to me like you just don't like this particular style of music, which is fine, but learn how to express your opinion as an opinion in order to avoid flaming wars that don't do anybody any good.

I agree with you aiwass. I like more underground music like some death metal because they dont care about fame and writing music that the majourity of the population want to hear. Look at metallica ! They could of stayed like they were before but no they had to change just because it wasnt "cool" to play solo's any more. Its not just the fact that they dont play solo's any more its their riffs too. They are turning into a form of nu metal. Some death metal bands arent very talented but i can think of quite a few that are really good and really know how to write killer riffs and really technical solo's.

man i listen to some black metal and not a lot of that...i like to select a good musical band not a picture

anyway i hear complicated solos all the time...maybe thats due to my lack of soloin, but still listen to hellhammer on drums and tell me who else can beat that...listen to bands like arcturus and ulver who have dont wonders with melody i think black and death meatl are both very complicated styles and very technical. bathory is technical whereas venom are more fun.
vocals yea theyre raspy a hard technique, just try to go on sining like that for a while without having to stop for some water. its not about image besides black and death meatl emerged from the depths not on tv..now it may be considered cool cus everyone thinks its about image..like nu metal for instance but these bands were unpopular cept amongst themselves at first. besides its not about writing some stuff that sounds good and evil..hehehe thats what eveyrone else on this planet creating music is on about.

like evry genre it has its bad bands..but it excels where other dont in speed/ tempo.....and drones and ambience. like other musical styles deliver frenzy best - jazz.

anyway

Good Death Metal.

1.Decapitated(just great writing..guitarist has a awsome style)
2.Dying Fetus(get past the name and read the lyrics...much more than 'Chop a virgins head off' stuff.Also among the first to use large amounts of sweeping within riffs)
3.Death(More proggressive and very deep.Chuck is still the man)
4.Lamb Of God(some call it 'metalcore',but whatever.They have great rhythm and better vocals.)
5.Cryptopsy(drummer is nuts,great riffs and halfway decent lyrics)




Good Black Metal.

1.Immortal(great theme,greater rhythm,greatest drums and a truly epic sound...)
2.Children Of Bodom(These guys early stuff reeks of black metal so I threw them here.Alexi is yngwies cool brother he never had.)
3.Krisiun(I'm placing them here for lyrical content..drummer is among the best.Relentless.)

Good Thrash.

1.Slayer(You all know these guys.Screw there new stuff.Divine intervention and everything before it is amazing)
2.At The Gates(really defined the genre for the early ninties)
3.Dimension Zero(along the lines of The Haunted)
4.The Haunted(thrash thats addictive...just good songwriting overall.)

Good Misc.

1.In Flames(yeah there melodic death metal,I know.Everything from 'Colony' and under was great.)
2.Opeth(Do I really need to highlight these guy strong points?Brilliant stuff.)
3.Meshuggah(progressive math metal?I dont know.Intelligent stuff though.)


Theres lots and lots of great more of everything,but that would take forever.I dont care for genres and placing bands myself,but its often needed as not to get flamed for not catagorizing.

Your my hero PONYONE!Bust them turds up!

Ok, at the end of the day I still don't really understand what the difference is between black metal and death metal. Is it like the difference between regular fries and curly fries? :P

On a different note, I present you with a serious question. Answer it truthfully. Do you guys HONESTLY think that the gutteral groaning/constipated sounds of death metal 'vocalists' really offer anything musical to the ear? I mean, do you actually enjoy listening to their growling and find some musical merit in it? The thing is, even if you like the band itself, the vocalist can ruin everything (in my opinion). This is why I never got into black/death metal. I used to listen to Metallica, Megadeth, and other heavy acts, but I could never get into death metal because as soon as the vocalist started singing, I would laugh my head off. Even to this day, I occasionally watch death metal videos on Much Music for a laugh...I can't take it seriously. It just sounds like garbage, even if there's a hint of talent from the guitarist or drummer or whatever. The only marginally-acceptable grunt vocalist (in my opinion) that sounded half-decent was Rob Zombie in La Sexorcisto....but even then, show music like that to your average joe or your parents, for example, and they'll say it's complete crap. Anyway, my head's out of metal these days. I found as I got better on guitar that it reflected on my musical tastes and stuff that once impressed me like 'Master of Puppets' no longer holds my interest (at least from a guitarist stand-point). Now, I much prefer instrumental shredders (Shawn Lane, Vai, Satch, the usual) and more retro stuff (SRV, Hendrix, Doobie Brothers). :)

Originally posted by finger_cruncher
On a different note, I present you with a serious question. Answer it truthfully. Do you guys HONESTLY think that the gutteral groaning/constipated sounds of death metal 'vocalists' really offer anything musical to the ear?

In death metal they dont groan. Maybe your thinking of korn.
Anyway, there has to be some heavy stuff in this world to headbang to. I mean, now metallica are crap and other great bands like megadeth arent around now, death metal is the only great think to headbang to. Thats what its for. Its not really for sitting down and relaxing too. I dont like all this cannibal corpse and mortician stuff that much but i really like bands such as death and Children of bodom.

hmm

Yea i do like the grunts

but i appreciate most kinds of music and it depends on my mood if i need to hear grunts ill hear em

if i need to hear and african woman singing deep notes ill listen to it

i cant say i prefer one or the other, But they scream that much for a reason. the way you present your music is the way u want to communicate so they feel its best thru grunts and wailing screams.

[Edited by concrete chaos on 01-21-2004 at 03:33 AM]

Most of it is crap, but every now and then I run across a few good bands in that genre, but I always end up seeing those bands in concert because they are all over the place in my city's local music scene.

The fact (good) death metal/black metal bands can conjure such an impacting voice warrants credit right of the bat.
Taking the human voice beyond 'la de da' and 'ohhHHOHhoHOHohHOH' isn't some living room event.

I realize that many people arn't patient enough to listen attentivley and gather the magic behind the mayhem...
Listen to 'zombie inc' from In Flames... really listen..
theres THOUGHT behind the voice..not just some mindless twisting of pitch or display of 'oooooohhhh's and 'ahhhhhhhh's.

the same goes for 'Demon in viens' and 'Aardvark Trail' from soilwork.Death's '1000 eyes'.Lamb of god's 'Vigil'.
Also almost anything by carcass.

eh whatever... music is to diverse to say 'this is this and that is that'.

Originally posted by concrete chaos
hmm
Yea i do like the grunts

but i appreciate most kinds of music and it depends on my mood if i need to hear grunts ill hear em

if i need to hear and african woman singing deep notes ill listen to it
[Edited by concrete chaos on 01-21-2004 at 03:33 AM]

My mother is like that. She usually listens to stuff like Dido, Tony Bennet and Roy Orbison but, depending on her mood, she sometimes enjoys listening to Opeth, Pantera and even Meshuggah, which at times is kind of funny.



Here are some screams/yells/growls that fit perfectly with music but most importantly of all sound great:

Many Opeth songs. The start of Bleak 1:20-1:40, inparticular.

The opening screams of Pig Destroyer's Piss Angel.

Devolved songs. Progress at 1:30-2:05 is almost a hook, when it comes to growling.

A lot of Blood Duster songs have memorable growls like in Pornstorestiffi yelling out "I like to run around rubbin' my stiffi!". They quite a few songs that sounds like growls shouldn't fit but do, like Metal As F*ck. It starts off with dueling blues/rock licks and then goes into riff that will get anyones head bobbing just as there's a deep throaty yell.

I like some black/death metal...some of it can seem kinda generic but the more melodic bands are pretty kool...
my favs of this category are: IN Flames, Cradle Of Filth, CHildren Of Bodom, Dark Tranquility, Death, and DImmu Borgir