What distortion pedal?

I have had trouble with a specific guitar tone in my head, I picture a sound in between fuzz and distortion. [br][br]

Problem is, I haven't been able to find a pedal that does that sound properly, I had a White Face Rat and hated it, then got a Boss BD-2 and thought it was good at first but soon got sick of the noise it causes on high distortion. [br][br]

What should I get for this sound? I also want it to cut through a mix well.

I thought a Green Russian Big Muff, Turbo rat, or an Op Amp Big Muff, any ideas? I'm open to other pedals or one of the three I mentioned above.

Originally Posted by: hunter.kane

I have had trouble with a specific guitar tone in my head, I picture a sound in between fuzz and distortion.[/quote][br]Do you have a reference point? Is there a band, song or guitar tone you can point to & say, "I mean this"?

Originally Posted by: hunter.kane

Problem is, I haven't been able to find a pedal that does that sound properly, I had a White Face Rat and hated it, then got a Boss BD-2 and thought it was good at first but soon got sick of the noise it causes on high distortion.

[br]A great deal of this depends on the guitar & amp. What guitar & amp are you using? How loud are you playing?

Some of what you are describing sounds like it could be handled by a loud amp with a good amount of pre-amp gain, but then just pushed a little harder by just a little bit of overdrive. Typically the more gain you add the more compressed the signal & the weaker the articulation. Sometimes if you stack gain pedals just using 25%-50% of gain from each is enough to get the right combination.

[quote=hunter.kane]I also want it to cut through a mix well.

A mix of what? What style of music are you playing & what instruments are in the mix?

Having said that, what usually cuts through a rock style mix of loud drums, bass & other guitars is mids. And mids are exactly what suffer the more gain you add.

Not exactly, closest thing would be Smashing Pumpkins and Sonic Youth

I use silver face Fenders, a PRS Custom 24, and I play quiet at home but loud when not.

A mix of what? What style of music are you playing & what instruments are in the mix?

a band mix, and the music I play is like Indie Rock/Noise Rock, the instrument being guitar, drums, bass, and vocals.

[br]What pedals do you think would work like that? I was thinking Proco Turbo Rat, a Green Russian Big Muff, an Op Amp Big Muff, or a Big Muff Pi.

Originally Posted by: hunter.kane

Not exactly, closest thing would be Smashing Pumpkins and Sonic Youth

[/quote]

Not my wheelhouse. How about some description? Harsh or smooth? Sharp & bright? Or dark & creamy?

[br]

Originally Posted by: hunter.kaneI use silver face Fenders, a PRS Custom 24, and I play quiet at home but loud when not.

[p]The PRS presumably has humbuckers which should be a good option for gain. The Fender not so much. I think a more modern amp with stronger preamp gain staging might help you in the fuzz/distortion department. Mesa Boogie, Diezel, Blackstar, 5150. Mabye just a good Marshall with an overdrive. :) [br][br]Have you tried any more modern high gain amps?

[quote=hunter.kane]What pedals do you think would work like that? I was thinking Proco Turbo Rat, a Green Russian Big Muff, an Op Amp Big Muff, or a Big Muff Pi.

Well, those are all various kinds of gain pedals that could work. It just depends on if they actually do what you want them to do. And you are the only one that can answer that question!

I think it's time for some experimentation & gear demoing!

Some stuff Billy was known to have used in the 'classic' era were a Big Muff, MXR Distortion (even together) and MXR Phase pedals (90's or 100's). He also used Fender Bassman and Marshal JCM 800 amps.

The Big Muff and Phase 100 seemed to be the most consistent gear.

Like a lot of players back, I think Corgan was pretty lofi with his gear. The other think you have to consider is that even with lofi gear, studeio wizardy does a lot to build a sound, like multiple layers of guitar and panned guitar performances (panned left/panned right). All of this tends to build the 'size' of the sound that sometimes makes the illusion of the tone when it was built on a core tone but with a lot other things done in the studio to make the end state sound.

Something I don't mention cuz it's one of those 'ya, ya, whatever' things but, a friend owned an amp used on a fairly iconic 80's hard rock album. Long story but it was that amp. I played through it. It was certainly an awesome amp...and I can dial in tone pretty well. It still didn't completely sound like the album. It sounded like a great amp with a kernal of tht tone. Other things like layering and the bass tone accompanied the guitar/amp to make what was heard on record.

So, as you chase tone, it's worth aiming for an iconic tone but also keep in mind what it took to get that to sound great on tape.

Hunter, I don't know how much this will help you. Very possibly none. But even if it doesn't, if you have the time to wartch it, it is fascinating.

JHS Pedals did a video called The History of Distortion. And it is just that, a history. He doesn't go through a demonstration of many pedals like so many of his videos. Although he does show representative samples of different historically significant pedals. Lots of those and maye one of those will trigger that tone in your head. Or get you closer.

At a minimum, it's interesting, informative and his videos are always fun. Not verbatim but "Now crank up your distortion and play really loud and annoy some people. That's what rock and roll is all about!"

I think I narrowed it down to the Green Russian Big Muff and the NYC Big Muff. What do you think?

Originally Posted by: hunter.kane

I think I narrowed it down to the Green Russian Big Muff and the NYC Big Muff. What do you think?

I don't have any experience with either of those pedals. And even if I did I still think you should try them if possible before you buy them. If you can find gear demo videos that might help. But there's still no substitute for trying it yourself. Happy gear shopping!

Thank you for the replies, I bought myself an NYC Big Muff two days ago, very pleased.

Originally Posted by: hunter.kane

Thank you for the replies, I bought myself an NYC Big Muff two days ago, very pleased.

Good deal! Thanks for the update.