Crisis In the Middle East

Lebonon is a weak country that the terrorists could care less that it gets destroyed. That's why they chose to work from there. You don't see attacks coming fro Syria and Jordan because thats where the leadership is at and the last thing they want is the US and/orIsreal coming after them. It's the quiet ones you have to watch.

My dad has been saying for years that "we need to just bomb the whole middle east." I always called him an idiot for it.

I still don't believe that's the answer, but that's what it'll come to. You watch. Terrorists will keep gaining power and being pricks in general, then one of the more powerful 'civilized' countries (probably the USA) will panic and nuke a bunch of countries down there. The ones who have nuclear resources (which from what I understand from all the TV fear-mongering is most of them), will bomb back, taking the liberty to hit that country's allies as well. Before you know it, WWIII.

I wish I could make people think the way I do. I mean, if it's just about the land, I think they need to realize there is plenty of freaking room for everyone. If it's about religion, agree to disagree. If it's about destroying Western civilization, I don't see why they went for Israel.

Originally Posted by: zreynoldspI've just read this on a news site - seemed to sum it up:

"The USA and its CIA/FBI (and with all their funds) couldn't detect nor stop 9/11. The British and its secret services (and all their funds)couldn't detect nor stop the bombings in London. The Israeli's and the infamous Mossad cannot discover in advance nor stop the suicide bombers that wander in its own territory. Yet no one accuses these countries as being a party to terrorism. But we expect the Lebanese and the Palestinians to have much better intelligence with virtually no resources?? Wake Up"

Fair Point?

Not even close to reality. The 911 attacks were a conspiracy by 19 people (which btw was detected by a military intelligence group Able Danger...only our bureaucratic miscommunication didn't do anything about it.) Hezbollah is equivalent to a political party of the Lebanese government operating in open public. And if Lebanon is too weak to remove such elements, then let Israel do what it's doing. They are going so far as to warn Lebanon to evacuate this building or that ahead of time because they are going to hit it. They also drop leaflets into neighborhoods for the same effect. And remember, we can stop 99 out of 100 terrorists plots (and have stopped a few recently, like in Canada, Miami, New York, etc.) but they only need that one to succeed to further their cause.

So the US retaliation after 911 was pointless, if just 19 people were involved. I'm not convinced that Israel is invading Lebanon to get the terrorists... rather then just to get more land and their soldiers back.

A leaflet wouldn't make me feel better about someone blowing up my community.

Originally Posted by: iihollySo the US retaliation after 911 was pointless, if just 19 people were involved. I'm not convinced that Israel is invading Lebanon to get the terrorists... rather then just to get more land and their soldiers back.

A leaflet wouldn't make me feel better about someone blowing up my community.

C'mon, that's stretching my point. The terrorists were trained by and loyal to Al Qeada (which is who we attacked), but otherwise were independent cells. We all know this. The point I was rebutting was that all our intelligence might can't stop terrorists. We can mostly, and do, but it only takes one, and until we go after the source it's just biding time.
Israel had occupied southern Lebanon to prevent the very provocations it's recieving now but withdrew in 2000. They also gave the Palestinians the Gaza strip and withdrew their own settlers from there. But it's never enough. Like I said, radical Islam isn't after land, only the destruction of "infidels". This is not presumption, but blatant public position...the total annihilation of Israel and the West.

A leaflet might not make you feel better, but you'll still be alive. Why don't you condemn the unprovoked rocket attacks into civilians by Hezbollah? I think it's clear which party is more civilised here.

And well put Pony...yer the coolest Liberal I know! ;)

I disagree with both sides. I just feel sorry for the everyday person who lives in Israel or Lebanon. I'm a sensitive liberal I know, but yeah can't help it.

Good point about the leaflet by the way. I wonder what the leaflets say approximately.

I'm going to move to Canada so I can be... just there. I hate living near Washington D.C. it makes me nervous with all this talk of another WWIII.

Originally Posted by: PonyOne..Though admittedly, I'm learning Japanese and plan to move to Japan :/

Hehe, don't forget about North Korea!
Naw, I think that whole missile thing was prolly just to get attention and force negotiations and appeasement. But then again, Kim Jong is pretty kooky, so who knows?
That sounds really cool though. I think I could dig their culture for awhile at least.

Points for debate:

World War III began in 1979, when Islamist forces in Iran overthrew the US-backed regime of the Shah. Jimmy Carter's utter failure to deal with that situation set the tone for all future conflict - those who long for death will always have a tactical advantage over those who value life. It is always easier to destroy than to build.

Originally Posted by: LordathestringsPoints for debate:

World War III began in 1979, when Islamist forces in Iran overthrew the US-backed regime of the Shah. Jimmy Carter's utter failure to deal with that situation set the tone for all future conflict - those who long for death will always have a tactical advantage over those who value life. It is always easier to destroy than to build.

I would argue that it began (somewhat ironically) between World Wars I and II.

Originally Posted by: jimmy_kwtxJust a quick question.

How many people that have replied to this post have military experience for their respective governments?

I do. Did four years active in the USAF.

Jimmy-sorry for your families loss. And I can relate to your post in a lot of ways. For those of us who donned the green and did our part, it can be tough some times to appreciate the opinons of others who did not serve. It took me a long to realize that just because they didn't serve doesn't make them any less patriotic or love their country any less than the vets. Although I do think our opinion is just as valid as any other, especially since we did serve.

It's funny but here I am, a vet and yet if I had to pigeonhole myself into one of the two more popular political camps in this country, I would call myself a liberal. But that's not really true I suppose. More of an independent. Be that as it may, I love my country, warts and all, and will do what I need to do to protect it. And protect all of it including, in my opinion, the most vital of the rights of every American, to say as they please when it comes to our country and government.

I do not like the current administration. I think that they have taken many decades of progress and shipped it backwards through time about 100 years and I also believe it will take another several decades to get us back on track. Point is, he is the President. If I were still in, I would still go as ordered and fight as ordered. "Ours is not to reason why..."

This current crisis has been years in the making and it won't end any time soon. I feel deeply for those directly involved and as stated early in this thread, pray daily for peace and wisdom. Sadly, we're talking human beings here. Peace and wisdom are not things that we humans do very easily or very well.

Originally Posted by: hunter60...It's funny but here I am, a vet and yet if I had to pigeonhole myself into one of the two more popular political camps in this country, I would call myself a liberal. But that's not really true I suppose. More of an independent...

That's really how people should think. I think it's somewhat dangerous to associate one's morality, ideology, or whatever based on a particular party's stance. We should try to be informed (which includes looking into both sides of issues) and make our own reasonable conclusions based on what we feel is right and wrong. I suppose it is a challenge though as it seems the country is becoming more and more polarized, and information is often biased.

Originally Posted by: RaskolnikovI would argue that it began (somewhat ironically) between World Wars I and II.

That's very disturbing reading! :eek:

I think, if you get attacked for no reason at all, it should be alright to retaliate. of course, I think you should only target those that attacked you, and try to keep civilian casualties to a minimum. but I'm not very informed on the situation, so don't mind me.

btw, Pony, if you move to japan I'm totally going to be asking you to buy so many parts for my car and ship them to me in america... it's not even going to be funny ;)

World War III Is Comming