Please tips for Ear Training! (Relative Pitch)

Please give me some tips how to make these exercises ( they are in a program called "Ear Trainer") less difficult or tell me how I should learn them.

1.) Intervals: I´m quite satiesfied with the results of this exercise. I can now name nearly every interval from min 2nd to octave (ascending), but I still have some trouble with recognizing these intervals: maj2nd, maj3rd, tritone, min and maj 7th. This is because I don´t find a melody where one of these intervals is very important, such as the min 3rd (first two notes) in the "Smoke on the water" riff.

So I´d be grateful, if you could give me similar examples for the missing intervals, or other tips.

2.) Chords: I´ve no troubles how to distinguish major and minor, because of the happy and sad difference, but it´s more difficult when I add Augmented.

Is there any other distinctive sound for the other chords(Augm, Dimi, maj 7, m7,...) ?

3.) Scales: Here I have already troubles how to distinguish major and minor. So please some tips for learning scales( if I should learn one at a time, if I should just listen to it without paying attention on whole, whole, half, whole, whole..., or if I should pay attention to this,.....) would be appreciated.

Basically the success behind mastering ear training is getting the sounds in your ear. The only way this is accomplished is by listening. Your right the minor 3rd is easier because you can relate the sound to the riff in smoke on the water. It's in your head. Try just playing the intervals you are having trouble with on your guitar and listen to how they sound. Listening is the key. The more you listen the easier it will become.

Try this: if you have trouble between the difference of minor and major intervals. Try playing all the minor intervals (listening closely). i.e. m2, m3, m6, m7. Then do the major ones. Listen and try to recognize the difference between them. This should be easy since you recognize one has a sad sound, the other a happy sound.

Other thing that helps infinitely is singing the intervals as you play them. Singing them has the tendency of putting the sound of these intervals deepr in the ear than any other way. It doesn't matter if your a bad singer or not, the range is the key.

If you having trouble getting the range down. Like you mistake a maj7th for a maj6th. Then try only doing all major intervals. As M2, M3, M6, M7. Just work on identifying the range of these intervals first, before judging there quality.

Both of these exercise emphasize a certain way of training. They focus on one part of the equation at a time and then when your ready. You can pull it all together. Sometimes the ear is unable to handle both the quality of sound (major or minor) plus the range (6th or 7th).

The tri-tone is the trickiest of all the intervals. It has an odd sound compared to the other intervals. I suggest saving this interval for last. Once you can discriminate between the other intervals, the tri-tone will have more presence and be easier to recognize.

When it comes to chords it's the same thing. Pick up your guitar and strum out each of the chords and just listen to the difference. The difference between the basic triads is academic once you just sit down and listen for a minute. As you play threw a few chords, you'll start to hear the difference. If you need too, strum the chords slightly arppegiated. Once you get through the basic triads, then try extended chords likes 7th's. When you hit the 7th chords. Try this trick. Say your going to play an Adom7 chord. Play a simple A major chord and then play A and G harmonically. And listen to the aural effect each has and then play an A dom7 chord. Listen for the harmonic sound you heard when you played A and G. Then listen to how it all blends together, that's the sound of a dominant 7th chord. Then play some more dom7 chord's just with a different root. i.e. G7, D7, Bb7. You'll start to recognize a similar sound that does not change regardless of the root. Then you'll have the dom7 sound in your ear.

At first, the sound will probably leave if you do this one day and the next you try to recall it. This is normal but if you consistantly listen in this way, the sound will stick more and more til the sound sticks completely.

Also when it comes to ear training don't rush and don't overload. Work on one chord or interval at a time. Then once you get that interval or chord down, add another. Patience is a virtue when it comes to ear training. You can't rush or you'll miss everything that is important and you will ultimately FAIL.

When it comes to scales, this training is much more advanced than the other two because you're recalling more than just one solid sound but rather a melodic progression of several notes. It's better if you become more efficient at intervals since the whole, whole, half is what you need to pay attention to.

Hope that helps.

Originally Posted by: noticingthemistakeBasically the success behind mastering ear training is getting the sounds in your ear. The only way this is accomplished is by listening. Your right the minor 3rd is easier because you can relate the sound to the riff in smoke on the water. It's in your head. Try just playing the intervals you are having trouble with on your guitar and listen to how they sound. Listening is the key. The more you listen the easier it will become.

Try this: if you have trouble between the difference of minor and major intervals. Try playing all the minor intervals (listening closely). i.e. m2, m3, m6, m7. Then do the major ones. Listen and try to recognize the difference between them. This should be easy since you recognize one has a sad sound, the other a happy sound.

Other thing that helps infinitely is singing the intervals as you play them. Singing them has the tendency of putting the sound of these intervals deepr in the ear than any other way. It doesn't matter if your a bad singer or not, the range is the key.

If you having trouble getting the range down. Like you mistake a maj7th for a maj6th. Then try only doing all major intervals. As M2, M3, M6, M7. Just work on identifying the range of these intervals first, before judging there quality.

Both of these exercise emphasize a certain way of training. They focus on one part of the equation at a time and then when your ready. You can pull it all together. Sometimes the ear is unable to handle both the quality of sound (major or minor) plus the range (6th or 7th).

The tri-tone is the trickiest of all the intervals. It has an odd sound compared to the other intervals. I suggest saving this interval for last. Once you can discriminate between the other intervals, the tri-tone will have more presence and be easier to recognize.

When it comes to chords it's the same thing. Pick up your guitar and strum out each of the chords and just listen to the difference. The difference between the basic triads is academic once you just sit down and listen for a minute. As you play threw a few chords, you'll start to hear the difference. If you need too, strum the chords slightly arppegiated. Once you get through the basic triads, then try extended chords likes 7th's. When you hit the 7th chords. Try this trick. Say your going to play an Adom7 chord. Play a simple A major chord and then play A and G harmonically. And listen to the aural effect each has and then play an A dom7 chord. Listen for the harmonic sound you heard when you played A and G. Then listen to how it all blends together, that's the sound of a dominant 7th chord. Then play some more dom7 chord's just with a different root. i.e. G7, D7, Bb7. You'll start to recognize a similar sound that does not change regardless of the root. Then you'll have the dom7 sound in your ear.

At first, the sound will probably leave if you do this one day and the next you try to recall it. This is normal but if you consistantly listen in this way, the sound will stick more and more til the sound sticks completely.

Also when it comes to ear training don't rush and don't overload. Work on one chord or interval at a time. Then once you get that interval or chord down, add another. Patience is a virtue when it comes to ear training. You can't rush or you'll miss everything that is important and you will ultimately FAIL.

When it comes to scales, this training is much more advanced than the other two because you're recalling more than just one solid sound but rather a melodic progression of several notes. It's better if you become more efficient at intervals since the whole, whole, half is what you need to pay attention to.

Hope that helps.

Noticing, if I get famous as a musician one day (which is not very probalble, but anyhow) I know whom I have to thank! Really helpful tips!! I didn´t even think about that intervals also sound happy and sad (maj and min), so this is really helpful now. Just one question about your Adom7 tip, when you say play A and G doyou mean chords or notes? And what does the term mean "Listen to the harmonic" ?

thanx but now i'll be sure to hit you up for some cash..ya know for retribution. ;) what i mean by A and G is pluck both the open A and open G strings together and listen to the, i guess, dissonance they make. Then listen for the same sound when you play a full A dominant 7 chord (x02020). Once you get that, then try a dominant chord but with a different root. Take E7 (020100) and listen for a similar quality that exists between A7 and E7. There is a similar sound that exists between all three, that would be the dominant 7th chord quality. It may or may not be faint at first so relax when you listen and accept what you hear (meaning don't look for something that is not there). You'll notice it. All x7 chords will have this same quality to them, even if there in inversion.

Note that identifying chords in inversion is a step further from just recognizing the chord quality itself. So stick with just chords in root position at first, and when you grasp that completely then you'll be ready to discriminate between inversions.

Ok, now I understand. So I can do the same thing with the m7 chords too, right? Firts play the root together with the minor 7th and then the whole chords and listen to the similar qualities.

Yes. But remember to first get a good grip on the basic triads first. Both the A7 and Am7 chords have A and G in them, the difference is in the basic triad. The dominant is a major triad with a minor 7th added, the minor 7th is a minor triad plus the minor 7th. In the first responce I said to first learn the basic triads and then move on to extended chords. I'm sure you know this, I'm just rewritting it too make sure. Cause if you don't know the sounds of the basic triads and you go str8 to extended chords. You'll be trying to swallow too much and you won't learn it.

But yes, you do this with all the chords. Even as you move up to 9th chords and beyond. An Adom9 chord, you would play an A7 chord first. Then play A and B and listen to the sound those 2 notes make. Then play an Adom9 and listen for that same sound in that chord. Seeing how they blend together you will learn how a dom9 sounds.

Point is you won't be able to grasp a dom7 chord, if you don't already know what a major triad sounds like, and you won't be able to grasp a dom9 if you don't already grasp dom7 chords.

It is as simple as it sounds, but you have to have patience and be willing to take small steps to really learn it.

Sorry if this post seems redundant, just making sure you fully understand the process.

The best way to practice is to plug in ear plugs and q-tips into your ears, eat cereal, play golf, then give up. I guarantee 100% it'll work. Trust me...or you're gonna get my sig!

Originally Posted by: noticingthemistakeYes. But remember to first get a good grip on the basic triads first. Both the A7 and Am7 chords have A and G in them, the difference is in the basic triad. The dominant is a major triad with a minor 7th added, the minor 7th is a minor triad plus the minor 7th. In the first responce I said to first learn the basic triads and then move on to extended chords. I'm sure you know this, I'm just rewritting it too make sure. Cause if you don't know the sounds of the basic triads and you go str8 to extended chords. You'll be trying to swallow too much and you won't learn it.

But yes, you do this with all the chords. Even as you move up to 9th chords and beyond. An Adom9 chord, you would play an A7 chord first. Then play A and B and listen to the sound those 2 notes make. Then play an Adom9 and listen for that same sound in that chord. Seeing how they blend together you will learn how a dom9 sounds.

Point is you won't be able to grasp a dom7 chord, if you don't already know what a major triad sounds like, and you won't be able to grasp a dom9 if you don't already grasp dom7 chords.

It is as simple as it sounds, but you have to have patience and be willing to take small steps to really learn it.

Sorry if this post seems redundant, just making sure you fully understand the process.

Yeah, of course I know this, but nevertheless it´s good that you repeat things, because I have already misunderstooden some tips for theory, technique or whatever. So it´s really important to be sure that the questioner understood your explanation, especially for ear training, where it could have fatal results.

I even decided to work first on the intervals (all ascending, and the high ones, which are the most important) and the essential intervals descending( inverse intervals, where you don´t need to know all by ear, as I was told) before starting the work on chords. I found out that a good exercise for intervals and improvisation is improvising and at the same time listening how the intervals sound and how some combinations of them work together,.....

I don't know who told you that descending intervals weren't as important as ascending ones but in my opinion they're wrong. Music doesn't always ascend in melody. It's better to pay equal attention to descending and ascending intervals. Music goes both ways.

Here's an exercise. Say your practicing the interval of a perfect fifth. You would play A and then up a perfect fifth to E. Listen and then sing (or hum)the interval as you play it. Then once you got that, do it in reverse. Play E and then down a perfect fifth to A. Repeat the steps above. The entire time you are focusing on a perfect fifth, one interval. Go through all the chromatic notes. So next would be Bb and F, and so on. Focus on the range, not the notes themselves and I quartantee if you do this everyday for a week. The sound of a perfect fifth will be sticking in your head. As you become confident, try singing the preceding interval before you play and then check yourself. Once you can sing the second note and get it right, you know it.

Make sure you sing your intervals, it's the only way to really get them to stick in your head. If you can sing it, there is no doubt that you know it.

Don't worry about being alittle flat or alittle sharp. You don't have to sing perfectly in tune, just as long as you get the range close and your not singing a different interval.

Also for extra support use the "do-ra-mi-fa-sol-la-ti-do" thing. This will help if your having some difficulty or feeling stuck.

Yes, anything that involves using your ear in music will help improve your ear. Improv, learning songs by ear, anything and everything where your using your ear in music helps. Picking out songs that you like and figuring them out yourself is one of the best and most rewarding processes of ear training. The excerises above are the groundbuilding steps. Pay attention to the musical quality of the stuff you play, it will reward you ten fold.

The guy who said this is Eric Vandenberg, on a web site, but maybe I also misunderstood him. He mentioned the basic intervals, the high intervals, and the inverse intervals, and to the last ones, he says, that only 3rds, 5th , 7th have a strong meaning, because of the chords. So maybe he meant something different. But anyhow, thanks again.

Everyone has their own ideas on how to learn stuff. Dry 'scales and modes' do nothing for me, or interval training. What is it's primary function?

Personally I could always tell the difference between minor, dom 7th, aug, dim, 9th, min6, min7 etc as they all have their own unique 'flavour'. I never had to question that from day-one.

The best way to work out how chords work is to work out songs. Listen to a couple of Beatles songs and then work out the chords to them.

As far as ear training goes, what I did was to play famous tunes, such as Pink Panther, Odd Couple, Bewitched - in fact any silly catchy tune I could think of.

After a while I found that I could play any tune on the guitar that i could whistle. If I can whistle it - I can play it straight off.

That's how I approached it.


Lee