help with pentatonic

i just got this site and i wrote down and got all the pentatonic scale modes or somthing of the major pentatonic scale. i was wondering if any1 out there could give me a example on how the pentatonic scale is used in songs "preferably rock since i heard its used in rock alot" like tab it out for me please any help will b much apreciated thank you

I recomend you search on guitartricks.com at the search-option -> Pentatonic. Or maybe Rock. I don't know, right now I'm kinda drunk, but do the search anyway. If that doesn't help you, I'll post a reply tomorow with some tabs during a penta major no problemo. Tell me within 30 h, or right now. it´'s okey. See you tomorow

lol ok ill try that but still post those tabs if u get the time thanks man

I was mystified by pents when I started on 'em.

Keep practicing and all will become apparent, especially when you try to solo over a I IV VII progression !

I think on reflection pents are the single most useful thing I have learnt about playing the guitar. Learning Bar chords and alternate picking are also up there however I think Pents get the crown !

Most blues is based around a pentatonic scale however the Blues scale has up to two extra notes (depending on who you talk to). Searching for "blues scale" will show you the difference between a pentatonic and blues scale however Id get the scale shapes down first and worry bout nuances later.

ok i know that i need to practice all the different ways of the pentatonic the thing is i dont understand "how" you would use them to make a song/solo or w/e i just dont get how ppl make a hole solo out of somthing like that

got to get some reasonable tab and read it as you listen to the music, learn it. that's how you learn.

(6, 9, b5, raised 3rds and 7s are all useful addons to the pent scale in blues i think.)

Maybe this can help.
First of all, MAJOR pentatonic is not all that prevelent or useful in Rock. Although it does lend it self to country styles very well. MINOR pentatonic scales however, are EVERYWHERE in rock and blues. It is by-far a much more useful progression to know and use. Here's the difference.

If you're familiar with scales, here is how both of them are laid out, with respect to a full major or minor scale (This is helpful in discovering other positions for playing these scales)

Major scale 1st _ 2nd _ 3rd 4th _ 5th _ 6th _ 7th 8th
major pent. scale 1st _ 2nd _ 3rd _ _ 5th _ 6th _ _ 8th

Minor scale 1st _ 2nd 3rd _ 4th _ 5th 6th _ 7th _ 8th
minor pent. scale 1st _ _ 3rd _ 4th _ 5th _ _ 7th _ 8th


"A" Major Pentatonic

E--------------------------------5----------------------------------
B--------------------------5--7-----7--5----------------------------
G--------------------4--6-----------------6--4----------------------
D--------------4--7-----------------------------7--4----------------
A--------4--7-----------------------------------------7--4----------
E--5--7-----------------------------------------------------7--5----

"A" Minor Pentatonic

E--------------------------------5----------------------------------
B--------------------------5--8-----8--5----------------------------
G--------------------5--7-----------------7--5----------------------
D--------------5--7-----------------------------7--5----------------
A--------5--7-----------------------------------------7--5----------
E--5--8-----------------------------------------------------8--5----

You can see why Minor Pent. is a much used scale for beginner guitarists. Your first finger stays on the fifth fret throughout the progression and finger is either on the seventh or eighth. Very simple.


Now, to see how this is used in a song, you first have to understand that scales are learned only to develop a template for a riff or solo. In most cases, you wont hear a whole scale played beginning-to-end during a song (metal heads will disagree). More often you will hear a solo or riff played "around" a particular scale, utilizing the notes contained in that scale.

Here is an example that you can learn to play. It is the main riff the Lenny Kravitz song "Are You Gonna Go My Way". I've changed the key to match the scale played above, but the riff will be instantly recognizable.

--------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------------------------------------------------------5----
--7-(9)-7-5p/o------------------7-(9)-7-5p/o------------------5----
----------------7-----5--7---------------------7------5--7----5----
-------------------7-------------------------------7----------------
--------------------------------------------------------------------

In case you're confused:

The 7-(9)-7-5p/o means:

You play the 7th fret (use your 3rd finger) then bend it up a whole step (up to the same note as the 9th fret, then release the bend until the note comes back to regular pitch. At that point, you pull that finger off so that the 5th fret note (played with your 1st finger) sounds. Your 1st finger should be placed on the 5th fret at the very beginning of this part (you can use it to help you bend that 7th fret note up and down.)

This first part should be able to be played with only one pick stroke, as it all happens fast. The remainder of the riff is very straitforward, and should be played with one pick stroke per note.

This is classic use of a minor pentatonic scale to form a riff. Play around with it by changing the order or adding other notes from the scale above, and you should start to recognize some other very familiar sounding progressions.

Finally, its very important for you to realize that scales are not solos. They are only one small part of what constitutes a solo or riff. There's also bends, pulloffs, hammer-ons, vibrato, harmonics, pick attack, dynamics, amp tone, pickup selection, muting, whammy bar technique, scrapes, squeals, pings, boings, etc.... All of which come together to make a solo. Trust me, nothing is more pathetic and uninspiring than listening to an aspiring guitarist try to pass off a litany of memorized scales as some kind of solo. Its the equivelent of going to hear a singer, and having them do nothing but "do-re-mi-fa-so...... Over and over.

I hope that helps you out. You can e-mail me if you have any other questions.

Originally Posted by: Bucky Trust me, nothing is more pathetic and uninspiring than listening to an aspiring guitarist try to pass off a litany of memorized scales as some kind of solo.

and, imo, the only way to avoid that is to listen to and eventually learn lots of other solos.

some of my favorite patterns

--------------------------------------8-5---------------------
------------------------------------------8-5-----8-5----------
-------------------------5--------------------8-5-----7-5-------7-5------etc
---------------5----5-7----7---etc.------------------------7-5-------7-5--
------5---5-7----7--------------------------------------------------------7-5
-5-8----8---------------------------------------------------------------

they're kind of excercise-ish but they should get you started on some ideas

thank you guys i messed around wit some of the stuff u put down and im starting to get it ill just keep practicing untill hopefully i got my own solo or somthing thanx again

Does anybody ever raise the 7th tone on the minor pentatonic? So instead of it being 1, b3, 4, 5, b7. It's 1, b3, 4, 5, 7. I use the raised 7th more than the flat 7th. IMO the raised 7th has a very nice modern sound to it and when used in the lick like "TheWizard" wrote. It lends to more of a progressive sound. Just wondering if anyone else has tried or uses that.

I use (not regularily however) pretty much every chormatic note at one time or another, mostly as passing notes or snuck in to add color...

I'd write more but it just started to thunder.

Originally Posted by: noticingthemistakeDoes anybody ever raise the 7th tone on the minor pentatonic?

Wouldn't that be the harmonic minor scale just without the 2 and b6. Haven't tried it but I bet it sounds pretty good.

... Like take your pent. box in A (low E string A pent box scale) and starting on the D on the A string .... yea I'll just write it out, goddamn.

|--------------------------------5-6-7-6-5--------8/---
|------------------------5-6-7--------------------7/---
|-----------------5-6-7--------------------------------
|--------5-6-7-----------------------------------------
|5-6-7-------------------------------------------------
|------------------------------------------------------

That raises pretty much every note in the scale - 4th, 7th, 3rd, 5th, even the root - and goddamn my goddamn miserable life if you can't use that going on to the D chord.

Originally Posted by: Badlands53Wouldn't that be the harmonic minor scale just without the 2 and b6. Haven't tried it but I bet it sounds pretty good.

Yeah that's one way of looking at it. Melodic minor too and if you don't flat the 7th in a descending run, Jazz Melodic minor. IMO it's always good to have a leading tone when it comes to melody writting (solos, licks). The b7 is good for bluesier soloing. However in rock, jazz and any other styles that don't have a downish feel to it; the raised 7th is really cool.

Basics - don't know man :confused:

Listen to the opening solo in Santana/Rob Thomas' "Smooth". It will give you a sense of the "flavor" that a maj. 7th imparts on a otherwise mostly Amin. pentatonic solo. Notice however, that the min. 7th is still present, (and its actually the predominant 7th that's played in the entire solo) The maj. 7th is used only for "effect".


-------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------------------------------12--12-13-12------12-13-12------
----------12------12--14------13--14-----------------14------------14--
--12--14------14--------------------------------------------------------
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-------------------------------------------------------------------------

Santana has a tendency to interject maj. 7th as well as flat 5's in otherwise minor progressions as it imparts a very "Latin" feel to the music.
Check out this technique on the "Eagles" "Hotel California"

Hope that gives you some sense of it.

Originally Posted by: Bucky The maj. 7th is used only for "effect".

Yeah. Also look at the fact that it is playing the role of "leading tone" to the root note that follows it. That's it's function there. If that G# was to resolve down a whole step (F#), it would sound wrong. If G was used instead of G# as the leading tone to A, the musical effect on that sequence would be "weak". The raised 7th is also preffered when using the V7 chord in a minor key. In blues however, the b7 is preffered due to the downish sound of the b7 over the harmony. So the blues minor pent should not be traditionally altered, a raised seventh in such a context is a non-harmonic (chromatic) tone. IMO the raised seventh only sounds right when used at the end of a sequence or cadence as (#)7-1(minor). In rock music I use the raised seventh more than the flat seventh because I prefer the classical approach to rock over the blues approach. Modern rock is just to fast paced to suggest "blues".

Originally Posted by: noticingthemistake Modern rock is just to fast paced to suggest "blues".

In your opinion of course which, disagreeable to me, is a valid one nonetheless.

Originally Posted by: noticingthemistake Modern rock is just to fast paced to suggest "blues".

BAH!


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