Metallica

Whats the best album? im tossing up between master of puppets and ...and justice for alll

JUstice for All was the last great album by Metallica, all downhill after that... Master of Puppets was amazing too, better musically but I like JFA for the agression and clinical tone. MOP wins for song writing though, also, a very unique sound.

Justice was the start of the sell out. They made a video for MTV. That's not metal.

Numerous bands inluding your favourites put out singles for all their cd's and Metallica making a video for MTV made them sellouts?

Originally Posted by: ikedaJustice was the start of the sell out. They made a video for MTV. That's not metal.

That's a pretty dumb thing to say. If bands didn't make music videos and put out radio singles and stuff, they would be unknown to the majority of music-listeners. You probably wouldn't even be aware metal existed, unless you specifically sought it out.

Hey, guess what...I think the Black album was an awesome achievement. :eek: Best? Well by sales it would be by far. But I dunno musically.
No, it wasn't what they put out before. Yes, it was heavily promoted and widely commercially successful...so what? It was still creatively original. Of course, by now it's so overplayed on the radio and whatnot I can't stand it anymore.

All that being said, 'Blackened' is my all time favorite tune of theirs...awesome start to an album!

you are all crazy. ride the lightning was the best album. it has that razor edge sound that metal is supposed to have and it just has some great beats. the best song by metallica has to either be escape or trapped under ice, but pulling teeth (kill'em all) has some good merits on that front too.

Originally Posted by: BrokenJerayou are all crazy. ride the lightning was the best album. it has that razor edge sound that metal is supposed to have and it just has some great beats. the best song by metallica has to either be escape or trapped under ice, but pulling teeth (kill'em all) has some good merits on that front too.

Glad somebody said it! Ride the Lighting was so awesome. I like MOP and AJFA a lot too, but for favorite I'd go with Ride.

Also, I hate to talk **** on Jason, but the albums started turning less "metal" when he joined. AJFA was their last true metal album (even though it had less of a hardcore metal feel than the others).

For me either Master of Puppets or their Black Album. I said it...possibly the Black Album.

I like the Black Album... but then again, I'm old. I mean, old school. Come to think of it, so is Metallica. So, that excuse doesn't work. How is it that 80's metal is coming back so strong these days?

its because the bands of today (stained slipknot static-x and all the others) dont have the same tonal reach of the 80's stuff. most of the newer bands start off heavey but when they get to a verse they either slow down or growl into the mic. alot of the older stuff a singer actually sang (for instance motle crew queensryche iron maiden) and the virtuosity of the guitar playing gave an opening to not only ultrafast playing but solos and lead work that bordered on genious. but thats just my view.

Heavy Metal became generalized as Black/Death Metal and anything that involved growling and screaming. Just ask someone on the street what they think Heavy Metal is, and unless they listen to it, they will give you the most stereotypical answer they can thing of....a bunch of screaming and growling guys who sing about death and Satan.

I think this is what the newer bands sort of reach out to. It's not about musical talent anymore, its about yelling as loud as you can and playing a lot of low tuned power cords. Whatever gives it a Heavy/"Hardcore" sound. Bands like Disturbed like to call themselves hardcore or heavy metal bands, but they aren't....they are just Hard Rock.

My personal opinion is that Radio just screws up music for people. They only play what is popular to ignorant High School teenagers, and they overplay the crap out of it. You will rarely hear a good metal band on the popular radio stations. Not because of bad language or anything, but because it just isn't "popular" with people today. It's all about ratings.

this is where i think metal has the biggest contradiction. metal was never supposed to be harmonicly perfect, in fact metal has more in common with punk rock then the blues. punk rock got its start in britian from disenchanted metal heads who didnt like the way metal was turning into hair metal when metal became more main stream and producers got their hands into more and more and felt again like they were abandoned by soceity.

if the best metal has both a rough edge and vurtuosity(sp). the rough edge comes from the speed and over all design of the riffs (the open E played in termolo picking over either double base drums or a pounding tom) but speed and the knowledge the desgin powerful riffs only comes from the study of theory and dedicated practice. today most metal is not written and played in the studio but built using 10 to 15 different guitar tracks overlaid and then refined to the finished product. the truest end to metal wasnt kurt cobain it was priests hell bent for leather and kiss' make up and boots, iron maidens eddie, and bon jovis hair. ROCK IS SPECTCALE.

so here is my theory, perfect metal is never perfect. it must be flawed but also must be built around solid theory and experence. harmonicly speaking following modes and scales to the letter will never create metal that has the tone to become perfect (i give zakk wylde as an example, he is an awsome player but to me his music lacks a certain jump or hook) wheres as adding sharps or flats or even jumping intervals when a mode says otherwise.

this is just my 3 cents and my theory. it is by no means perfect and is still under a great deal of work.

Right, metal does not have to be perfect, but in order to make good metal, you do need a good knowledge of music theory. Simply stringing together a bunch of notes that sound cool together (which is what I feel a lot of new bands do) isn't enough. If they don't fully understand the music that has inspired them, they cannot produce music that will inspire other musicians.

The term Heavy Metal or Metal. Was first used in a review about Black Sabbath back in the 60's according to the extensive documentary I watched on it. The documentary had all of the Metal Icons talking at certain points in their own words and they seemed to agree.
I actually watched a movie last night that was a comedy and 90% of the music on the movie was by the 80s group Europe.... They were part of what killed 80s metal. Along with all the other groups that went to the Power Ballads and started using tons of Makeup and Hairspray. BUT there is no doubt they still had some of the best killer guitar parts. And their songs had killer hooks and were super tight. But the lyrics were super corny and they looked like a freak show.
I am happy though that Iron Maiden, Metallica, Slayer, Megadeath and many of the others that did not go the route of the Hair Farmers are still out making music. Just the opinion of a person who graduated High School in 85 and wore nothing but Iron Maiden, Metallica and Judas Priest Concert Shirts to school every day. :rolleyes: Oops I almost forgot the original topic. I would have to go with ride the lightning. And I think all of their albums are good. Even the ones that get all the commercial play. Its funny when I listen to Master of Puppets or Ride the Lightning I cannot believe how they do not sound that Heavy anymore. I remember back in the day when they were just the most insane Heavy thing out there. Now compared to Killswitch Engage, Lamb of God, Mastadon, Trivium Etc. They do not sound so Heavy. But they still Kick Butt!!

Originally Posted by: hunter1801Right, metal does not have to be perfect, but in order to make good metal, you do need a good knowledge of music theory. Simply stringing together a bunch of notes that sound cool together (which is what I feel a lot of new bands do) isn't enough. If they don't fully understand the music that has inspired them, they cannot produce music that will inspire other musicians.

that's a great point. I completely agree with that.

Originally Posted by: FingerSpasmThe term Heavy Metal or Metal. Was first used in a review about Black Sabbath back in the 60's according to the extensive documentary I watched on it. The documentary had all of the Metal Icons talking at certain points in their own words and they seemed to agree.
I actually watched a movie last night that was a comedy and 90% of the music on the movie was by the 80s group Europe.... They were part of what killed 80s metal. Along with all the other groups that went to the Power Ballads and started using tons of Makeup and Hairspray. BUT there is no doubt they still had some of the best killer guitar parts. And their songs had killer hooks and were super tight. But the lyrics were super corny and they looked like a freak show.
I am happy though that Iron Maiden, Metallica, Slayer, Megadeath and many of the others that did not go the route of the Hair Farmers are still out making music. Just the opinion of a person who graduated High School in 85 and wore nothing but Iron Maiden, Metallica and Judas Priest Concert Shirts to school every day. :rolleyes: Oops I almost forgot the original topic. I would have to go with ride the lightning. And I think all of their albums are good. Even the ones that get all the commercial play. Its funny when I listen to Master of Puppets or Ride the Lightning I cannot believe how they do not sound that Heavy anymore. I remember back in the day when they were just the most insane Heavy thing out there. Now compared to Killswitch Engage, Lamb of God, Mastadon, Trivium Etc. They do not sound so Heavy. But they still Kick Butt!!

dont listen to any of those bands "Now compared to Killswitch Engage, Lamb of God, Mastadon, Trivium Etc. They do not sound so Heavy. But they still Kick Butt!!"
but im almost for certain that every one of them either uses 7 string guitars or tunes to c. 90% of metallica is played instandard with the rare one step down( sad but true) drop d(the thing that should not be) and half step down (i think misery was played half step).

Actually Lamb of God tunes in drop D, some times standard and they're one of the heaviest bands out there. Trivium also plays in standard and neither band uses 7 string guitars.

Originally Posted by: BrokenJeradont listen to any of those bands "Now compared to Killswitch Engage, Lamb of God, Mastadon, Trivium Etc. They do not sound so Heavy. But they still Kick Butt!!"
but im almost for certain that every one of them either uses 7 string guitars or tunes to c. 90% of metallica is played instandard with the rare one step down( sad but true) drop d(the thing that should not be) and half step down (i think misery was played half step).

Your right about the tunning. Killswitch plays in C. I tuned to it and played some of their stuff. But then got totally lost when I tried to improvise anything.
I also have a guitar tuned to Drop D for playing Alter Bridge stuff. Its easier for me to play that way. After playing in Drop D I finally figured out how they were playing some of the stuff that was so complicated in standard tuning. It can spoil you for sure.

When Metallica came to Mexico for the first time they played sad but true with standar tunning (on the 2nd show at least)... it just spoiled the whole song.

For me the best Metallica album is AJFA, and I have to say... well, I stopped listening to Metallica after load... it just seemed unnatural for me what tey were doing, but with time I forgive them and actually like St. Anger (hope i won't get bashed away for that) but dunno why... metallica will always have a special place in my music taste... James is a great rithm player and singer for metal, and sometimes I just wanna blast Creeping death or the thing that should not be in my Ipod...

Hope Robert T. brings new sounds to them... they shure could use some more metal.