soloing ideas


MadGuitarest
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MadGuitarest
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08/05/2004 7:10 pm
ive been reading up on some theory and it is pretty confusing but im doing it slowly because i cant sit there and rad it for more than an hour. But anyways i play solos pretty well from artists, i listen to the records and play by ear and i do well at it. But what if i want to play my own solo.. I have tried and have done kinda soso but not to well. What are some tips in a solo?
I know that you have to base the solo section around what key. But how far off from the key note can you go. Like can u play with other notes in a lead without the note of the key that is playing. Please help me with some tips on it. thanks
Mike ;)
# 1
lee33
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lee33
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08/06/2004 8:25 pm
There is more nonsense writen about guitar than any subject I can think of.

It's pretty fundamental really. You play what you hear in your head.

It's no good taking bits of scales and mode fragments and pasting them together and expecting them to sound like a solo any more than you can cut and paste bits of newspaper and make it sound like Shakespeare.

Play a few chords and hum or whistle a solo over them. Did you think about scales? Modes? Or did you just whistle what you heard in your head?

Well guitar soloing is just the same as whistling (or should be).

Learn to play what you hear in your head - and you have freedom.
There's only one scale worth knowing - and it's called the 'chromatic scale'.


Lee
# 2
Julian Vickers
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Julian Vickers
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08/07/2004 1:44 am
I guess it's different for each person, but I like to know what I'm playing. I consider the Major Scale an extremely useful tool for building solos. I study at Massey University Conservatorium of Music doing jazz. While of course it is helpful to be able to play what's in your head, having sound knowledge of the major scale and it's modes is probably one of the best things you can do for developing your soloing.
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# 3
ketsueki15
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ketsueki15
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08/07/2004 4:00 am
your ear is the greatest tool there is...USE it and use it wisely...i dont know **** about jazz chord progressions, jazz soloing, modes or anything..I just play and it sounds jazzy to me...Im sure it is very helpful to know modes and all that but that would require me to think too much and when im tryin to solo and think at the same time..it just doesnt work for me
i think Azreal said to learn all the theory you can and then forget it...i think it was him..im not really sure though
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# 4
noticingthemistake
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noticingthemistake
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08/07/2004 4:28 am
I think what characterizes a good solo is a solo that has a "good singing tune" to it. Mindless whalling up and down different scales, and pulling off fancy techniques alone won't make a good solo.

I suggest just listening to your fav. solo artists, especially jazz players. Even though the musical qualities of the solo are complex, there is still a often subtle melodic tune behind it. The melody is the most paladable thing to the ear, and since the guitar solo takes front stage. It must have some melodic interest. If not it's dull and really does carry you anywhere.

As for writting your own solo's. It's just another one of those things that the more you do it the better you get. But if you keep "the singing tune" in mind, you're solos will progress much faster and be more enjoyable. Another thing that will help is analyzing the solo's you already know. Learn both the rhythm and lead parts and see how they interact. Look to see what chord the rhythm is playing, say Aminor. Next look and see what notes are in the solo while that chord is sounding. Go through the whole solo and pay attention to this interaction in as much detail as possible. You'll learn alot.

Apply what you learn, keep a singing tune in mind, and just keep writting. That's my advice.
"My whole life is a dark room...ONE BIG DARK ROOM" - a.f.i.
# 5
lee33
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lee33
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08/07/2004 7:36 am
Originally Posted by: Julian VickersI guess it's different for each person, but I like to know what I'm playing. I consider the Major Scale an extremely useful tool for building solos. I study at Massey University Conservatorium of Music doing jazz. While of course it is helpful to be able to play what's in your head, having sound knowledge of the major scale and it's modes is probably one of the best things you can do for developing your soloing.



I play jazz too, Julian. I'm completely self-taught.

I just don't understand what you are saying.

When you write a letter to someone you hear the words in your head.

When you play a solo or whistle or hum - you surely hear the notes in your head?

I hear the notes against the chords and I know where the notes are on the fretboard. It makes no difference as to what key they are in as I know where they are. I obviously use a scale pattern as that is how the guitar is mapped out - but I always hear the note I'm about to play at the same time I'm playing it. Have you heard George Benson play and sing at the same time?

I can't understand how it can be any other way.


Lee
# 6
Julian Vickers
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Julian Vickers
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08/07/2004 11:24 am
if that works for you lee, then thats really great. What I was trying to say is that knowledge of the major scale will help you greatly when constructing chords and chord progressions, and then being able to solo over them.

One of the great things about jazz of course, is there are no rules. you don't have to play just the notes defined by the major scale and the key of a song, there are many things you can add to your solos that theoretically don't fit and that can sound Really Great(tm).

Learning the Major Scale and it's modes and how to construct chords from it has greatly improved my ability to solo over chords and even construct my own melodies. So in other words, learning music theory has helped me to pluck musical melodies and ideas from my head and put them into music form easily and then put chords over it and that knowledge can help me make what came out of my head even better (if that's possible)
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# 7
TheDirt
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08/08/2004 6:36 am
The time to secure my place as "King of Analogies That May Have Been Better Left Unsaid" has come again...

Think of driving a standard... you can learn to do it shifting "when it feels right", but knowing the finer points of exactly what R.P.M. you should switch over at for the best gas mileage or how to effectively combine downshifting with your brake usage to increase brake pad life can't hurt, right? I mean, you can drive either way, but once you learn the technical stuff, you drive better. The same goes for music theory... you can play guitar without learning it, but the theory just provides some guidelines that can help.
"You must stab him in the heart with the Bone Saber of Zumacalis... well, you could stab him in the head or the lungs, too... and the saber, it probably doesn't have to be bone, just anything sharp lying around the house... you could poke him with a pillow and kill him."

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# 8
BluesMetal
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BluesMetal
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08/09/2004 2:25 pm
Lee, you seem to think all people have this inate ability of perfect pitch..lol I wish. "Play what you hear in your head", you say... You actually make me smile alot and I thank you for that but alot of people that ask these types of questions are not to a point where they can hear it and apply it without though, as for me when I solo I don't hear anything I just catch the rhythm and let my fingers start doin' their own thing. I have ran scales enough times that my fingers know what to do with out me thinking or hearing.
My advice to anyone just getting into soloing is cruse the internet and find licks and small voicing patterns you like the sound of and learn them. Note what key they are in so you know thier root and then you can apply them to any key. The hardest thing for most new soloists to do is give the scales voice rather than making it sound like your walking up and down a scale. Also throw in a few bends when your practicing scales, you will star learning what soounds good to you.
Theory is good to know, I learned theory long before I picked up a guitar while playing trumpet in Jr. High band but knowing why this or that does or does not sound right is good knowledge to have.
# 9
ketsueki15
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ketsueki15
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08/09/2004 10:50 pm
Bluesmetal...i takes time and practice..I have only been playing for 3-5 years but if I hear it in my head I will play everynote till I find that note i hear in my head..It is a very time consuming process but now figuring crap out by ear has become easier..You start to find patterns when your figuring stuff out by ear...Now if only i could figure some of the classical music I listen to out by ear.....
hey azreal..do you ever plan on tabbing out Mephisto Waltz by Liszt :) :) :)
jk...thats probably not possible on the guitar..curse guitar and its limitations to play piano music....i think i need to learn to play the piano
In memory of Randy Rhoads
# 10
kpxmikey89
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kpxmikey89
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09/17/2004 2:24 am
what i do is.. well i really like Yngwie.. and just started abosrbing steve vai
but i kept studyign scales yngiwe uses and technicallities like pedal toning, arpegging, tapping, alternate pick sweeping, stuff like that... like solo ideas you know? i only played ygniwe stuff for 1 year or year half, and i can improvise in his style, scales, mostly Eb harmonic minor and Ab harmonic minor, F# too, and just solo and improvise in my own jamb session and never be stuck...

just.. pick an inspried artists u really like, and play his compostitions day and nite.. 2hours atleast per day.. study scales he uses, tekniks
# 11
The Ace
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09/17/2004 2:24 pm
Originally Posted by: lee33There is more nonsense writen about guitar than any subject I can think of.

It's pretty fundamental really. You play what you hear in your head.

It's no good taking bits of scales and mode fragments and pasting them together and expecting them to sound like a solo any more than you can cut and paste bits of newspaper and make it sound like Shakespeare.

Play a few chords and hum or whistle a solo over them. Did you think about scales? Modes? Or did you just whistle what you heard in your head?

Well guitar soloing is just the same as whistling (or should be).

Learn to play what you hear in your head - and you have freedom.
There's only one scale worth knowing - and it's called the 'chromatic scale'.


Lee


You nailed it there. I've been trying to get this across to people. You can't play a bunch of random notes and hope to get anywhere. It's all about your ear.

BluesMetal - You don't need perfect pitch to do this. It does take a lot of work on your ears part, but it does get easier.

You need to start thinking of different ideas that can work. Try this - take a lick that you know and love, that you can play without even thinking about it. Now take the last note, but hum or whistle or sing a different note to replace it, that still makes it a good lick, just a little different. Now put it on guitar. Ok now try a different note and do the same thing. As time grows on and you keep doing this, eventually you will be able to hear what you are going to play before you play it. DO NOT confuse this with perfect pitch.

Ok cool that was my 2c.
There are only two important things in life - There's music and theres girls, not necessarily in that order....
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# 12
Dr_simon
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09/17/2004 2:36 pm
I don't think this is a binary issue i.e. it is not either: (i) "hum it" or (ii) "know the scale patterns".

I think one complements the other and it is ultimately self defeating to try and do one with out the other !

I want to travel to Newcastle from Iowa.

Do I have to use only one mode of transport to get there ?
No !

I can use the train and the plain and even the automobile !
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# 13
iamthe_eggman
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09/18/2004 4:16 am
Originally Posted by: Dr_simonI can use the train and the plain and even the automobile !


Those aren't pillows!!! :eek:
... and that's all I have to say about that.

[U]ALL[/U] generalizations are [U]WRONG[/U]

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# 14
Jolly McJollyson
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09/18/2004 5:08 am
Originally Posted by: ketsueki15hey azreal..do you ever plan on tabbing out Mephisto Waltz by Liszt :) :) :)
jk...thats probably not possible on the guitar..curse guitar and its limitations to play piano music....i think i need to learn to play the piano


I have the powertab to Hungarian rhapsody by Liszt....Edit: Oh, wait...you got banned...
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# 15
pikengren
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09/18/2004 7:42 am
when i first started trying to do my own solos, i took a very simple and practical approach. i'd record a lengthy recording of the chord progression that i wanted to solo over, so that i'd have time to experiment, and wouldn't have to mess with rewind right when i had an idea starting to develop.
someone mentioned melody. that's the way to go, it gives you some kind of base to build on. come up with a simple melody, it doesn't have to be fantastic, just as long as it fits, and/or is suitable to your tastes.
try different variations of the melody. learn to play the melody an octave higher, and lower. play one variation, use one of your scale runs to get you an octave higher, and play a different variation of the same melody.
the melody gives you a comfortable place to go back to, where you know it will fit. in your warping and twisting of the melody, you will hear/find/create other licks and you may actually have to pause the tape to get them just how you want them.
this helps to get the "hear it in your head" thing going as well.
# 16
noticingthemistake
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09/19/2004 1:05 pm
Originally Posted by: Jolly McJollysonI have the powertab to Hungarian rhapsody by Liszt....Edit: Oh, wait...you got banned...


Huh? Azreal got banned? :eek:
"My whole life is a dark room...ONE BIG DARK ROOM" - a.f.i.
# 17
Dr_simon
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09/19/2004 1:28 pm
Naaaa Azrael is still around.

You can always check the sin bin on the forum leaders page !
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# 18
Azrael
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09/19/2004 4:23 pm
me? banned? what are you thinking???? *LOL*

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# 19
ckandes1
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09/19/2004 10:45 pm
Originally Posted by: lee33
It's no good taking bits of scales and mode fragments and pasting them together and expecting them to sound like a solo any more than you can cut and paste bits of newspaper and make it sound like Shakespeare.
Lee


That is a freakin great line.
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:cool: Ckandes1
[/FONT]
# 20

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