Harmonizing Riff

Not big into theory yet; my mind hasn't expanded, taken the time, or grasped the complete concept yet, lol

Anyway, i'm looking to the best way to harmonize a riff. I'm sure its based loosely on a scale (only scale I kno completely so far is Am Penta) and it starts out on the box position more or less. I've been told to harmonize u could raise it vertically 1 1/2 steps. What i'm lookin for is advice how to play the same melody up and down the bottom two strings.

If u're confused as to what I mean or I worded it wrong, check out the openin riff to "Trapped In A Corner" by Death. The way it moves up and down the strings with same melody in mind is what I'm aiming for. Any questions, comments, or advice is greatly appreciated in advance. Thanks guys

Shaggy

Gavin has a tutorial on harmonizing two strings.

http://www.guitartricks.com/tutorial.php?input=240


A quick and easy way to harmonize in fifth and in octaves is to use powerchords. A powerchord is created by using a root note and a fifth. You'll often see people adding an octave of the root note.



G5 powerchord
--------
--------
--------
---5---- G
---5---- D
---3---- G


Using the powerchord structure has a reference point, you can easily find the fifth and the octaves. So if you want to harmonize in fifth, use powerchord in your riff and you'll find all the fifth and octaves you can use.


Simple exemple

Riff - riff using powerchord - riff using octaves

----------- ----------- ----------
----------- ---------4- --------4-
----------- ---4-5-7-4- --4-5-7---
---------2- ---4-5-7-2- ----------
--2-3-5---- ---2-3-5--- ----------


You can do the same exercise for fifth.

Edit : Thx for the tip Christopher!

Start with the primary way to harmonize a line. Pick a scale; we'll use the A minor scale for this example. Play it in a linear manner.

E |-------------------------------------|
B |-------------------------------------|
G |-------------------------------------|
D |---------------5-7-------------------|
A |--------5-7-8------------------------|
E |--5-7-8------------------------------|

Next is the crucial idea, the concept of diatonic harmonization. Pick a note of the scale you want to harmonize, then play another note by "leapfrogging" over the note in between.

Want to harmonize the note "a" in the A minor scale? Start on the "a", leapfrog over the next note "b" and land on the "c". Therefore, "a" and "c" are "harmony notes". They are a diatonic third apart on the scale. Therefore, this is called harmonized thirds. This is the most basic, primary way to harmonize.

So in order to "harmonize the whole scale" one line would be the minor scale starting on any given note and the harmony line would be the same scale but starting two notes higher up (or lower down) that same scale.

Guitar main melody
E |-------------------------------------|
B |-------------------------------------|
G |-------------------------------------|
D |---------------5-7-------------------|
A |--------5-7-8------------------------|
E |--5-7-8------------------------------|

Guitar 2 harmony line
E |-------------------------------------|
B |-------------------------------------|
G |-----------------5-------------------|
D |----------5-7-9----------------------|
A |----5-7-8----------------------------|
E |--8----------------------------------|

There are, of course, other ways to harmonize. You can harmonize in intervals other than thirds. But thirds is the best place to start. Hope this helps.

Not fair! Christopher found the way to make the tabs look good in his post!

I gotta get that secret.

Both explanations were pre cool, helped out a bit but......and i'm sorry to both....harmonization wasn't quite what I was looking for. OBV thats what I said (out of my own ignorance), but it wasn't what I was needin explained. I feel a bit humiliated now, but either way, I was hopin to get my question answered and i'm hopin someone will be kind 'nough to answer it (if not, no biggie).

Ex. - "Trapped In A Corner" -- Death

The opening riff (I believe LaRouque's part), moves along the D & G strings.


Code:

E |---------------------------------------|
B |---------------------------------------|
G |--10-11--10-----10-11---10-11-10-----|
D |8-------8------8--------8----------11-|
A |---------------------------------------|
E |---------------------------------------|

Then it moves up 3 frets, then down 1, then up 3 again. This moving up and down of frets, with the same melodic idea in mind is what I was trying to explain, but I obviously missed it. I was hopin to discover some theory behind what would make it sound maybe darker, heavier, more melodic, who knows.


This is the metal riff that has been tossed and turned with no clue how to a keep the melody flowin smoothly. So far, best results have occurred where I go from root measure (below), up 3 frets, up another 2 frets, and.....thats where I lose it at.

Code:

E |-----------------------------------------------------|
B |-----------------------------------------------------|
G |-----------------------------------------------------|
D |-----------------------------------------------------|
A |-5-----5------7-----7------8-----8-----8-7-5-8-7-5--|
E |-5-555-5-555-5-555-5-555-5-555-5-555--------------|

Granted, its an easy, simple metal lick, and i've played less then 2 yrs, I was hopin to learn how to move the 'idea' up and down the board so that the next measure, the notes would be 3 frets up, and next measure move up or down, so on and so forth, much like the Death example I showed.

If anyone could help me out, even after my feeble attempt in my first post, it would be greatly appreciated. If u need to ask more questions cuz my long post, feel free.

Thanks guys,
Shags

No problem. Based on what you wrote in your last post, I think the concept you are after is essentially scale visualization. In other words, how to move up and down the neck to different positions, while still staying in one scale.

Based on your example riffs, I would say you need to be able to visualize the A minor scale all the way up and down the fretboard on two adjacent strings. Like this:

||---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
||---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
||---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
||---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
||---|---|-C-|---|-D-|---|-E-|-F-|---|-G-|---|-A-|---|-B-|-C-|---|-D-|
||---|---|-G-|---|-A-|---|-B-|-C-|---|-D-|---|-E-|-F-|---|-G-|---|-A-|

Using that mental visual image you can see that your riff is part of the A minor scale. Now you can move up to the next position and change this:

E |---------------------------------------------------|
B |---------------------------------------------------|
G |---------------------------------------------------|
D |---------------------------------------------------|
A |-5-----5-----7-----7-----8-----8-----8-7-5-8-7-5---|
E |-5-555-5-555-5-555-5-555-5-555-5-555---------------|

To this:

E |---------------------------------------------------|
B |---------------------------------------------------|
G |---------------------------------------------------|
D |---------------------------------------------------|
A |-7-----7-----8-----8-----10----10----10-8-7-10-8-7-|
E |-7-777-7-777-7-777-7-777-7-777-7-777---------------|

Or down from the original position to this:

E |---------------------------------------------------|
B |---------------------------------------------------|
G |---------------------------------------------------|
D |---------------------------------------------------|
A |-3-----3-----5-----5-----7-----7-----7-5-3-7-5-3---|
E |-3-333-3-333-3-333-3-333-3-333-3-333---------------|

So you can move the melodic idea up and down the fretboard, but if you want to stay in one scale (or in one key) simply observe the pattern the scale forms on the frets. You can of course simply move the same pattern up and down the neck, but that is not staying in one key. That is called either modulation (momentary key changing) or transposition (longer-term key changing). These, of course, are also valid methods of changing a riff to add variety.

Hope this helps, let us know how it goes.

Schuldiner used a lot of 5th harmonies - almost exclusively in fact. One thing he didn't do a lot was vary the harmony - my only gripe about Death in general (excellent band IMO). He nearly always played straight 5th's as opposed to harmonised counterparts that went off in a different directions - but that is what created that instantly recognisable style.
Play the route note then go to the next string and move up two frets (just like a power chord) - that's basically your harmony. He used to base most of his work on the harmonic minor scale - gives that dark eastern feel.
The reason this harmony works well is that it forms a powerchord - but each note is played cleanly and clearly on separate guitars as opposed to two guitars playing powerchords. This work very well for intricate passages especially if you want to make them sound dark and heavy - sometimes the bass will play an octave lower than the route note or an octave hgher to create a chord structure. Hope that helps.

Thanks guys. Schlegel caught the idea perfectly of what I was tryin to get at. Thanks man...i'm gonna work out what u advised.

As for superhuman, 1) its cool that u posted seein as u knew ur **** 'bout Chuck and Death, 2) i'm gonna check out the harmonic minor, and 3), damn man, i checked out the song link in ur sig, pre wicked man. Just thought u should kno

Thanks both of u...both gave me different points of view but still helped.

Keep on rockin'-
Shaggy Bonez

Let me introduce myself, I'm from Florida and I was inspired to play electric due to seeing some great bands live all the notes that play in my head!
Is Smoke on the Water an example of a power chord?

Thanks to schegel and benoit for those explanations! I will read again but is it possible to use different scales together in a song.
I stopped learning songs for awhile to learn only scales until memorized.
I have been playing for a year and lessons for 6 months. I might not go back to the instructor! I have been happy I found these forums!
Is it really that important to use ones ear to learn a favorite song over tablature? I like reading the tab and listening to the song to learn!
Thanks again!