Composing Songs Besides Using Major and Minor Scales

I am starting to compose a few songs and I was wondering about scales. It seems like all my songs are constructed by major and minor scale patterns.

Can someone offer some spice to my song writing so I am not limited to these scales? Are there any other scales that are worth mentioning. Maybe even modes?

Thanks,
SnowRose

The only others I know are pentatonic scales and dorian.

Originally Posted by: bigbudaThe only others I know are pentatonic scales and dorian.

Is that kind of like the Blues Scale? Pentatonic I mean.

And isn't dorian from Minor and major?

Originally Posted by: SnowRoseIs that kind of like the Blues Scale? Pentatonic I mean.

And isn't dorian from Minor and major?

No. Blues scales are 6 note scales, pentatonics are 5 notes. They're very similar though. The only difference between the minor blues and the minor pentatonic is the diminished 5th shows up. And the difference between the minor blues and the major blues is the minor 7th becomes a major 6th.

In other words:
Major pentatonic:
w w 1-1/2 w 1-1/2

Minor pentatonic
1-1/2 w w 1-1/2 w

Major blues
1-1/2 w h h w 1-1/2

Minor blues
1-1/2 w h h 1-1/2 w

Editor's note: This is stuff I should've added in when I initially made this post. The thing about dorian. Yes, Dorian is involved in major and minor scales. The major scale itself is the Ionian mode. Dorian is just the next mode in line. So if we're playing in C Major (C D E F G A B) then Dorian would start on D. The minor scale is Aeolian, which is the second to last mode in the scale. In this case that's A.

Try one of the Middle Eastern box scales, they sound awesome - Opeth and Lamb of God use them to great effect. The Spanish scale sounds awesome for more subtle stuff, and if you're really adventurous, try figuring out a Hindustani raga for guitar!

Here's a Middle Eastern scale that I like to use:

E----5--6-----------------------------------------
A---------4--5--7--8---------------------------
D----------------------5--6-7----carry on up the octave :)
G---------------------------------------------------
B---------------------------------------------------
E---------------------------------------------------

If you're into heavy metal, listen to "I Am I" by Queensryche to get an idea on how to use this scale. The scalar shape can be easily used on any fret on the E string.

try the harmonic minor, its sexy.
e|------------------------------------|
B|------------------------------------|
G|------------------------------------|
D|---1-2------------------------------|
A|--0-2-3-----------------------------|
E|--0-2-3-----------------------------|

sorry about the way the numbers are, although it obviously doesn't matter as long as you have the postition.

You can try the Harmonic Minor Scale. It is a very exotic scale that evokes sounds of ancient Egypt.
If you play that scale in the key of “A”; you would play the following notes: [A-B-C-D-E-F-G#].

The Harmony of the “A Harmonic minor scale” gives you the following chords:
Am-Bdim-Caug5-Dm-E-F-G#dim.

A basic chord progression based on a Cadence for that scale(iv-V-i) would be:
Dm///E/// Am///



A Harmonic Minor Tab.

E-------------------------------------------------------------------4---5---
B----------------------------------------------------------5---6------------
G--------------------------------------------4---5---7---------------------
D-----------------------------------6---7----------------------------------
A---------------------5---7---8-------------------------------------------
E--------5---7---8--------------------------------------------------------

S**t, sorry, I've written the tab for the Middle Eastern scale upside down :o

Well all of your songs will be based on the Minor or Major scales, because those are the only chords that can be tonicized. However, if you want to get into atonal theory, then you could have a diminished chord be your tonic. I'm guessing though, that this kind of theory may be a little too advanced ( I don't even understand it that well ), so you could always write a song in a mode.

Example: Write a song in F Lydian

Scale - F G A B C D E F

Hope that helps

I think a great thing for you to do would be to study modal theory. You will learn how to evoke certain moods by creating chord progressions using the various modes. You'll have whole new worlds of sound to work with.

Check out any of the following for more information:

Modes, No More Mystery--by Frank Gambale
Modes--by Tom Kolb
Practical Theory--By Don Latarski

I got a pretty good handle on modal theory from one of those crappy books with a name like "Do-it-yourself-guitar" or "Instant Guitar Virtuoso" or "The Cretin's Guide to the Guitar" - you know the type. It was in my school library. The rest of the book was oversimplified rubbish, like almost everything else in my school library, but the modal theory pages were actually quite helpful.

I agree

knowledge of modal theory will definetely open up a ton of new doors for your writing. And as Nick said, different modes will have different emotional appeals depending on the context you play them in.

It depends on your style. I was just introduced to Parallel Keys which is the idea of playing a chord but ignoring the key. For example, Say I want to play a CMaj9, I'd play that for 2 measures then switch to an EbMajor9. Here is where theory would come in. I would improvise over that using the major modes. The only 2 major modes I can use are Ionian and Lydian. (Mixolydian, though major, can't be used because the 5th degree in the key is a dominant 7th which is a flat 7th so that mode would sound bad) If I want to use say the Lydian Mode accent I would find the key to play in in which C is the 4th degree and the key in which Eb is the 4th degree. (G for the first one and Bb for the second) Then, you'd improvise in the with those keys over your chords.

It's a very Jazz Fusion sound.

with the locrian scale in G, the fourth tone would be a C#. am i just not understanding that properly? it seems to me that if you were playing the locrian scale to make the fourth tone a C you would have to play the F# locrian and the A locrian for the Eb.

oops. substitute locrian for lydian. i suppose it would work with locrian. hah. now explain to me how the #4 of a lydian scale in G equals C. maybe im just retarded.

You are correct. In G Lydian the 4th would be C#

Yes, the modes will definitely open up a whole new world for you.

You can have modes based on a major scale as well as the harmonic and melodic minor scales. These are the ones that are most commonly used.


I would recommend checking out the resources that were mentioned. (the Frank Gambale video explains the modes very clearly)

Hope this helped.

Mike.

Originally Posted by: Nick LaytonYou are correct. In G Lydian the 4th would be C#

AUGMENTED FOURTH!!!!

WOOOOOOOOOOO!

for that middle eastern scale, dick dale uses it a lot. that scale just screams "SURF!!!!!"