Dime A Dozen

Originally Posted by: finger_cruncherBelieve it or not, attitude is a huge factor though....almost as important as being an awesome guitarist. So the fact that you 'click' with people on a musical level is a huge deal. There are absolutely amazing musicians who are a pain in the ass to work with because they bring attitude/arrogance into the studio and then there are decent musicians (who may not be able to play 6-string sweeping arpeggios at 200 mph), but are great to work with and easy to get along with. Personally, I'd rather play with an average musician who is ambitious and easy to get along with rather than an amazing arrogant musician who believes he's God's gift to the world, shows up late to rehearsals, thinks he's better than everyone else, etc.

I'd rather play with Paganini than some ****-up high school violinist who happens to be humble.

Look, in the world of music, the one thing that matters is music. I don't care if you're a dick or the nicest guy in the world, as long as you can play, I'll play with you. Once you say "Well I'm not that great but i have a great attitude!", you are giving yourself a reason not to become better.

~Incidents

Originally Posted by: PonyOnenot to piss in anyone's coke or anything, one way side or the other...

my whole outlook on the situation is that i'm a musician first, and a showboat second. i play what i feel i need to play and if that gets me props at the guitar store, cool... if it gets eyes rolling at the guitar store, then big deal.

i remember overhearing some kids (at the time they were probably older than me... :D) going on about how fenders were "gay" and "only good for soft rock" and that you needed "a Jackson or Ibanez" through a "Mesa or Marshall" to sound good at a Mars Music... I was about 16 at the time... just for the hell of it i took an orange Fender Cyclone and plugged into a Fender twin, and started belting out solos and arpeggios and everything I thought was really "hard" and they gradually started to kind of walk by, you know, checking the situation out...

i put the guitar back and weny to buy some cables, and on my way back, one of the kids has the Cyclone plugged into the Fender twin and one of the other kids is saying something to his girlfriend about how Fenders have a cool vibe, I just bust out laughing as I walked by.

that's my guitar store story.

That's a good one, you've told us that one before though, right? Or was that somebody else?

Originally Posted by: PonyOneyeah... well, like i said... it is my guitar store story :D

And a fine one it is! It's pretty sad that I can remember a post you made from May of 2003. Maybe I'm on this forum board too much and need to get some 3-D friends...

yo everyone
I was reading this thread for a bit when it hit me that i had to give my opinion on this all(and i hope no one mentioned it already). Its not just playability and uniqueness in your playing. I have been threw like 100 bands and I loved every single one of them and I had about 4 songs with each till we hit a snag and the band broke up. Now you would think with a reputation like that, that ppl would think I curse bands but i am still asked to filling for other bands all the time and i get around 20 calls a year from an old freind telling me his band needs some help writting music. You see I ant the greatest guitarist actually I ant even really anything special at all but whatever my point is the music I write hits the spot of alot of the ppl I play it too. After a performance or whatever they say you should make a cd already man, and since I dono s*** about computers or recording I havent gotten to release a cd yet. Ppl try to get me to learn about computers I just play the guitar thou,ya you guys know what I am talking about. So its not really just about playing really well or uniquely its making NEW MUSIC. let me explain with some examples:
The Beatles-they have thee most simple songs ever but i mean common they are amazing.
Led Zepplin-THEY MADE ROCK AND ROLL WHAT IT IS!!!
I dont gotta say anymore about them exept that jimi page wasnt the crazyest guitarists but the music they wrote was.
The Who-holy crap props to these guys!
these three bands have one thing in common-REVALUTION
and if you dont know these bands go out and beat yourself till your dead....ok you can go out and buy some of there cds.
one more example, a cd, by:YES
Roundabout
I have literally studied that cd for a year now breaking it up into tracks, riffs, beats, solos, the full cd, by instrument, everything! and my conclusion is thats probably the most creative cd i have ever heard and i recommend everyone to listen to that cd even if you dont like that style listen to it. ok so what am I trying to say
its about the music you WRITE and PLAY not just
i am the fastest shredder around or i am thee best whatever
its about the bands soul into a song! o ya another point the band does have to really "click", the band has to be like best of buddys ya know go out on the town alot not just we play together ya ok well I this helps someone.
just as a little fact about me, I know like maybe 20 songs by another artist everything else is written by me. this causes a great effect since i deleve into my own style over and over again refining it again and again. anyways thanks for listening if ya did haha
later

talk about a head-ache getting through that post!

~Incidents

who cares if you're the best guitarist in the world? if you have no hit record then it amounts to nothing. Get a hit record first. Even if you're a crappy guitar player as long as you get a hit record, you're fine. there's so many bands out there with average guitar players who have hit records and people worship their asses like crazy.

There's a reason why your screen name is 'the fool', and you've just shown it.

~Incidents

As much as I hate to say this "Incidents Happen" it's a sad fact- nowadays, you don't need to have talent anymore. Look at the amount of garbage bands out there who have crappy guitar players and yet turn out better financially. I said it once and I'll say it again. "You don't need talent!" No one cares if you're the fastest guitarist or the best guitarist in the world. If no one buys your crap it amounts to nothing. Even if you only know three chords, as long as you have the looks or the right attitude, people will likely buy your crap more than the "better" musician who doesn't have the looks. The more people buy your crap, the more likely you'll get hit records, and the more likely you'll be more remembered and more appreciated than the better guitarist who didn't have any hit records. This is the fact of life. I hate it as much as you do- there's so many better guitar players out there who deserves so much more but end up being starving musicians and there's nothing we can do about it. Most of the great guitar players nowadays remain underground and rarely mainstream. The corporate world holds us by the balls dude whether you like it or not and they dictate the way by which this world turns- they all want us to be freakin' jessica simpsons, britney spears, justin timberlakes, and nick whatever- his- name is.

I suppose that's a point, but how many of you actually want to be pop-culture guitarists? People like Bela Fleck, Leo Kottke, John Mclaughlin are making money without denegrating thier musical abilities, they just aren't front page artists. people like Yngwie, Vai, Satch make money, just not the kind of money pop artists make. There is plenty of money to be made, it just depends on the source.

~Incidents

I wonder how much money can be made by not being a mainstream musician, but having a fairly dedicated core audience like satch, vai, yngwie, etc..

I know their stuff sell better in other countries (ie Japan). But is that where the lion's share of their money comes from? Or is from touring all the time. I'd like to make it the way the Grateful Dead or Phish did, just by having an awesome live act, touring all the time, and having a loyal audience following.

Originally Posted by: Incidents HappenThere's a reason why your screen name is 'the fool', and you've just shown it.

~Incidents[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=the fool]As much as I hate to say this "Incidents Happen" it's a sad fact- nowadays, you don't need to have talent anymore. Look at the amount of garbage bands out there who have crappy guitar players and yet turn out better financially. I said it once and I'll say it again. "You don't need talent!" No one cares if you're the fastest guitarist or the best guitarist in the world. If no one buys your crap it amounts to nothing. Even if you only know three chords, as long as you have the looks or the right attitude, people will likely buy your crap more than the "better" musician who doesn't have the looks. The more people buy your crap, the more likely you'll get hit records, and the more likely you'll be more remembered and more appreciated than the better guitarist who didn't have any hit records. This is the fact of life. I hate it as much as you do- there's so many better guitar players out there who deserves so much more but end up being starving musicians and there's nothing we can do about it. Most of the great guitar players nowadays remain underground and rarely mainstream. The corporate world holds us by the balls dude whether you like it or not and they dictate the way by which this world turns- they all want us to be freakin' jessica simpsons, britney spears, justin timberlakes, and nick whatever- his- name is.

Just 'cause he's got 1500 posts doesn't mean you have to take his crap.

Incidents Happen

That's the point- no one wants to be pop- culture guitarists but the problem is, most people go where the money is. Even the revered guitarist of the old days are turning to pop. What happened to the old tonny iommi, eric clapton, angus young, slash, pete townshed and other great guitarist etc?- I think everyone's stuff nowadays has deteriorated and has become a bit more tamed compared to their earlier materials back in the old days during the 70's and 80's. The thrill is gone. Why? Because they've crossed over. They all have to follow the direction where the money is (controlled by the corporate world) to survive. Even satch and vai- I think they are great guitarist but I like their older records better.

Leedog
You asked how much a mainstream musician makes? A lot. I agree, having a fairly dedicated audience is good but they don't make as much as mainstream. Yngwie, Satch, and Vai are making a lot of money because they are mainstream now. That's why they don't care about playing great guitar anymore. They have nothing to prove. They have the money and the guitar endorsements etc. They know that most people will buy their record and their guitars because of their name, fame etc. Music has little to do with it. That's what most of them do. Start writing great stuff in the beginning. When they got fat and rich. They start slacking off and start not caring for quality anymore because they know people will still buy their records! Look at Elvis. He was one of the greats and I give him credit to it but I think his older records are better than the later ones.