Ok i know....

In conclusion to my post about learnnig to shred ive tried learning some pentatonic scales maj and min but i cant seem to string them together to make up any good lines is there a way of doing this or is it amatter of practice, Also is there any songs i could learn which would help me become a better "shreder"

Originally Posted by: lee33There is more nonsense writen about guitar than any subject I can think of.

It's pretty fundamental really. You play what you hear in your head.

It's no good taking bits of scales and mode fragments and pasting them together and expecting them to sound like a solo any more than you can cut and paste bits of newspaper and make it sound like Shakespeare.

Play a few chords and hum or whistle a solo over them. Did you think about scales? Modes? Or did you just whistle what you heard in your head?

Well guitar soloing is just the same as whistling (or should be).

Learn to play what you hear in your head - and you have freedom.
There's only one scale worth knowing - and it's called the 'chromatic scale'.


Lee

I think this guy has a point, Is this right or is it essentual to know theory
because i was told by a freind today that some guitarists dont even use theory e.g. Dimebag of pantera and hes a great guitarist

There is an exercise that people like steve vai use to get good with the pentatonic scale.
What you do is play on note then the next and the next starting from the lowest note on the neck in a certain key and keep going untill you reach the highest note in on the neck in that key and then go back down. You can play maybe two notes on the low E then move to the A string and play a note then move to the D string and play 3 notes then move to the G string and play two notes etc.
Thats just an example but just remember to always play a higher note than the last note you played if your going up the scale and always a lower note than you've just played if you are going back down the scale and always end on the highest note when going up the scale and the lowest note when going back down the scale.
Do this for all the different keys.
This should help you get better at making better solo lines from pentatonic scales rather than just going up and down the shapes.
When you've got good at this just try playing the pentatonic scales over some backing track and try and improvise. Eventually you will get use to where the notes are on the neck that you can play !

Van Halen doesn't know theory too well either. ;)

Nor do I, never found it essential to really learn it. So long as what you write sounds good, who cares what key you play, or scale, or mode? Some people may tell you different, others will agree its nonessential. It does tend to make music a little more... sophisticated though. I mean, before I started learning scales and chord building everything I wrote sounded pretty similar. Now it just has more flavor. Its just a personal preference of whether you want to take the time to learn it, or just go play until you have something cool.

If you are stuck, its probably time to hit the books, if not well don't !!

Slash doesn't know theory, and he's one of the greatest solo players of our time.....

I don't know theory, and I can improvise solo's all day. It's all about using your ears....

What do you mean by theory ?

Knowing and applying a major / minor or pentatonic scale is music theory .

Or, for that knowing where a A is on the fret board is music theory.

Knowing an A minor chord is music theory.

Originally Posted by: Dr_simonWhat do you mean by theory ?

Knowing and applying a major / minor or pentatonic scale is music theory .

Or, for that knowing where a A is on the fret board is music theory.

Knowing an A minor chord is music theory.

I mean theory like Apllying major / minor pentatonics

Originally Posted by: JFRICKSlash doesn't know theory, and he's one of the greatest solo players of our time.....

I don't know theory, and I can improvise solo's all day. It's all about using your ears....

How do you improv solos do you just get a tune in your head and try to play it out on your guitar?

Originally Posted by: JUSTSOMEGUYI mean theory like Apllying major / minor pentatonics

.....Which also requires at least a little knowledge of music theory.

It is total nonsense to say "so and so the rock star knows no music theory" with out being a little more specific.

Any one who can play any scale or any progression of chords knows some music theory whether they say it or not !

Originally Posted by: Dr_simon.....Which also requires at least a little knowledge of music theory.

It is total nonsense to say "so and so the rock star knows no music theory" with out being a little more specific.

Any one who can play any scale or any progression of chords knows some music theory whether they say it or not !

I never said anything about rock stars knowing theory, But yeh i guess thats true

So say if they just know what frets are played on which strings, but don't necessarily know the key or what the scale is called, the mode, or the notes they're playing, just going off fret numbers and by sound, can you really say they know theory? I mean sure you can't go and say "Yeah he has a basic knowlege of theory and knows exactly how to apply what he's playing", that's rather obvious...

Note: I'm still learning here as well, and don't mean to come off as hostile or trying to start an argument, this question is an all seriousness.

I hope I don't come across as too hostile either, that is not what I mean to do.

What I am trying to do is tell people how I have had successes and failyers and that thinking in things in terms shades of grey is often more useful than simply seeing everything in terms of black and white.

Also remember that people like my self who having been playing for 20+ years can get set in their ways, and that does occasionally make me crabby (yes I am that old git!).

Anyway, in answer to your post.... Yes ! Because theory is vast and covers many different things.

Examples being: how to construct a chord, which chords go together and sound a certain way, how scales are constructed, and how they work with chord progressions.

So, to play a really nice sounding solo doesn't require a vast amount of theoretical knowledge, but it dose require some to know a) which chords are being played by the rest of the band, b) which notes or scales to play over the top of the chords everyone else is playing.

No need to write a thesis on the modal structure but It helps to know what a pentatonic scale is !!

Alright, thanks for clearing that up. I'm sure I can come off as a jackass at times but my intentions are completely innocent I swear. :P

i think it is good to make up solos in your head and that kind of stuff but if you know what key your song is and you know a scale to that key then it will definitly help because you might spend a lot of time just fishing around for the right note and the scales can also help you in improvising which is a very good thing if you want to be a good guitarist

Ok thanx i see what you mean