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Scrambled scales - Tips for Improvising in Different Tunings


Andre D
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Andre D
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Joined: 08/03/24
Posts: 20
08/15/2024 2:42 am

Hey Folks,


I have a question that came up recently, and I don’t recall seeing a lesson specifically addressing this issue.


While learning a song in a half-step down tuning (which I adjusted my guitar for), I found that the scales I had learned didn’t fit well with the jam track. The challenge was that I had to shift all the scale shapes I memorized up a half-step to match the track. While tuning the guitar back to standard tuning is a straightforward solution, I’m wondering if there’s an easier technique or mindset for adapting scale shapes when playing in different tunings.


Is there a practical method to move scale shapes up and down the neck when your guitar is tuned differently? Or is this why many guitarists, like Slash from Guns N' Roses, switch guitars many times during a concert—to avoid the hassle of adjusting their playing positions for different tunings?


When someone plays half-step down, does the entire band move half-step down, or does one guitarist move his position half-step? 


This also raises the question of alternate tunings—do any of the scales, modes, or CAGED system work with those? What mindset does a musician need to approach their playing to use these alternate tuning options and still sound "right"?


I hope this makes sense, and I’d appreciate any insights or tips you might have!


Thanks!


edited
# 1
ChristopherSchlegel
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ChristopherSchlegel
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08/15/2024 12:01 pm

If the entire guitar is tuned up or down relative to standard, then you simply shift everything up or down the appropriate amount intervals.  I cover how to play all 12 diatonic major & minor scales in three main patterns in these tutorials.


https://www.guitartricks.com/tutorial/2643/


https://www.guitartricks.com/tutorial/2646/


If any one or more strings is tuned up or down a different amount than the others (drop D, open G, etc.) then you just have to adjust the patterns for that string(s).  That's more a matter of learning, practice & familiarity.


Yes, everyone should play in the same key together.


Hope that helps.


Christopher Schlegel
Guitar Tricks Instructor
Christopher Schlegel Lesson Directory

# 2
Andre D
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Andre D
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Posts: 20
08/15/2024 1:59 pm
#2 Originally Posted by: ChristopherSchlegel

If the entire guitar is tuned up or down relative to standard, then you simply shift everything up or down the appropriate amount intervals.  I cover how to play all 12 diatonic major & minor scales in three main patterns in these tutorials.


https://www.guitartricks.com/tutorial/2643/


https://www.guitartricks.com/tutorial/2646/


If any one or more strings is tuned up or down a different amount than the others (drop D, open G, etc.) then you just have to adjust the patterns for that string(s).  That's more a matter of learning, practice & familiarity.


Yes, everyone should play in the same key together.


Hope that helps.

Hi Christopher,


Thank you for this. It does help with understanding the practical aspects of alternative tuning. 

However, conceptually, I might be missing something here.


Why would a musician want to do that (tune the guitar to a different standard)?

I can guess that shifting the standard tuning  up or down has more to do with the vocal range, so the band doesn't need to "re-learn" the song. Same shape and alternative tuning. Not sure if I guessed this one right. But I can't understand the practical use of, let's say, a drop D, Open G.


Thanks in advance Christopher.


 


 


# 3
ChristopherSchlegel
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ChristopherSchlegel
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08/16/2024 4:54 am
#3 Originally Posted by: Andre D

Hi Christopher,


Thank you for this. It does help with understanding the practical aspects of alternative tuning. 

However, conceptually, I might be missing something here.


Why would a musician want to do that (tune the guitar to a different standard)?

I can guess that shifting the standard tuning  up or down has more to do with the vocal range, so the band doesn't need to "re-learn" the song. Same shape and alternative tuning. Not sure if I guessed this one right. But I can't understand the practical use of, let's say, a drop D, Open G.


Thanks in advance Christopher.


 


 

Transposing can help vocalists.  It can also help instrumentalists play in keys that are easier for them, or they are used to.  That's another use for capos.


Alternate tunings are good for making it possible or easier to play certain notes together that might be more difficult (or even not possible) to play in standard tuning.  Examples:


Open G allows you to play major chords bay simply barring across all the strings on the same fret.  This makes slide playing easier.


Drop D gives you 2 notes below the low E that normally wouldn't be available.


One of my personal favorite examples is Van Halen's 'Top Jimmy'.  There's no way to get those notes as natural harmonics of the intro unless you retune to that open Dm7(no3rd) chord.  And the rhythm guitar part uses that tuning for some standard chord voicings but in somewhat unusual sounding patterns.


So, it's essentially another way to be creative & give you options not normally accessible.


Christopher Schlegel
Guitar Tricks Instructor
Christopher Schlegel Lesson Directory

# 4
Andre D
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Joined: 08/03/24
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Andre D
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Posts: 20
08/16/2024 1:47 pm
#4 Originally Posted by: ChristopherSchlegel

Transposing can help vocalists.  It can also help instrumentalists play in keys that are easier for them, or they are used to.  That's another use for capos.


Alternate tunings are good for making it possible or easier to play certain notes together that might be more difficult (or even not possible) to play in standard tuning.  Examples:


Open G allows you to play major chords bay simply barring across all the strings on the same fret.  This makes slide playing easier.


Drop D gives you 2 notes below the low E that normally wouldn't be available.


One of my personal favorite examples is Van Halen's 'Top Jimmy'.  There's no way to get those notes as natural harmonics of the intro unless you retune to that open Dm7(no3rd) chord.  And the rhythm guitar part uses that tuning for some standard chord voicings but in somewhat unusual sounding patterns.


So, it's essentially another way to be creative & give you options not normally accessible.

Hi Christoper,


You are just a GENIUS! 


I tried searching for some info on the topic, and it wasn't really useful. You made it very clear and simple to understand. It's even better in text.


 


On top of it, it only makes us appreciate Eddie Van Halen a lot more. I keep seeing references to him on multiple answers here. Just ahead of his time. 


 


Really appreciate the reply Christopher. Have a nice weekend. 


 


 


 


# 5
ChristopherSchlegel
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ChristopherSchlegel
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08/17/2024 3:21 pm
#5 Originally Posted by: Andre D

Hi Christoper,


You are just a GENIUS! 


I tried searching for some info on the topic, and it wasn't really useful. You made it very clear and simple to understand. It's even better in text.


 


On top of it, it only makes us appreciate Eddie Van Halen a lot more. I keep seeing references to him on multiple answers here. Just ahead of his time. 


 


Really appreciate the reply Christopher. Have a nice weekend. 


 


 


 

Glad it helped.  There are quite a few GT tutorials on alternate tunings.  Do a search for "alternate tuning".


https://www.guitartricks.com/search?query=alternate%2Btuning


Thanks & have a good weekend!


Christopher Schlegel
Guitar Tricks Instructor
Christopher Schlegel Lesson Directory

# 6
Andre D
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Joined: 08/03/24
Posts: 20
Andre D
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Joined: 08/03/24
Posts: 20
08/17/2024 5:37 pm
#6 Originally Posted by: ChristopherSchlegel

Glad it helped.  There are quite a few GT tutorials on alternate tunings.  Do a search for "alternate tuning".


https://www.guitartricks.com/search?query=alternate%2Btuning


Thanks & have a good weekend!

That's for giving some direction here.


Have a nice weekend. Keep helping here, it makes a difference. 


# 7

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