Acoustic Discomfort


soody54
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soody54
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09/06/2013 2:22 am
Hi all. I'm just re-starting to learn after about 30 years, and I'm loving it already. One problem....I bought a beginner Fender AT-100 and thought it would be comfortable, and not too wide for me across the body, as well as not too deep. Since I'm just learning, I can't find a comfortable position for my right arm to fit across the body, and can't figure out what to do with the (lap) side of the guitar. I'm petite, so my arms are somewhat short, but my fingers are long-ish. I am halfway through Core Lessons, and am wondering if it is normal for the inside of my elbow to get sore - or did I buy the wrong guitar size (concert) for my body type? I'm JUST getting my left hand fingertips used to the abuse, and waiting for my callouses. I can deal with that, but the discomfort on the inside of (just below) my right elbow (on my forearm, actually) gets really SORE! Help!

Thanks,

Aunt Soody
# 1
dowland58
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dowland58
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09/06/2013 1:47 pm
Maibe could of some help to post a picture
of your right forearm while you are playing

(It seems possible that you play with excessive
muscular tension)
# 2
maggior
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maggior
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09/06/2013 2:52 pm
Download has a good idea.

One question - how does the guitar feel as far as reach of your fretting hand? Do you feel like you have to stretch your arm way out to use the first fret? If so, it may be that the guitar is too big for you in general.

I'm of smaller stature (5' 5") and I have to say my dreadnaught acoustic isn't the most comfortable thing for me to play, but I manage. I feel like I have to lift my arm up and over to get to the front of it to strum. When I was a little overweight, this problem was made worse. My daughter (9 years old) has a 3/4 size acoustic that is a blast to play and is super comfortable.

If the guitar is too big for you, or just isn't comfortable for whatever reason, you might consider getting a 3/4 size guitar. Once you advance past it, it can make a great travel guitar. Or, if that is the appropriate size for you, it can be your main guitar.
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soody54
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soody54
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09/06/2013 3:17 pm
Wow, these are both great suggestions. I took a picture but can't get it to upload since it's 300kb and the limit is 100. I tried making it smaller, but can't seem to get there. Darn it! I'll keep trying, though, because this is a great idea. Thanks, Downland58!

Maggior, it sounds like we have the same issue with the size of the guitar and our body type. I should also correct my original post; this guitar is a dreadnaught, and I am not a skinny girl either. I'm also shorter, at 5'2. I considered the 3/4 size guitar body, but was afraid of looking like I was playing a kids' guitar. I have the very same problem with rifles, for what that might be worth (as far as my shorter limbs go). With practice, I seem to get used to the issue, but it isn't as much fun at the beginning, like now! I do feel like I have to stretch out my fret arm quite a bit. I just had carpal tunnel surgery last year, with complications, so I thought this would help strengthen my hand, and I love the effect already.

THANK YOU BOTH for responding with such smart ideas. I have a feeling I'll be needing to take a trip to Elderly Instruments here in the Lansing (MI) area to have this evaluated in person. It might be time for a smaller guitar!

Bless you both. I am LOVING Guitar Tricks for so many reasons!

Sue
# 4
maggior
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maggior
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09/06/2013 6:20 pm
You're very welcome - I'm glad I was able to help you out a bit.

Don't worry about the "playing a kid guitar" bit. 3/4 size does not equal beginner guitar and does not equal kiddie guitar. It just so happens that this size guitar suits those needs. You can can get a really nice 3/4 size guitar, like a Baby Taylor. My daughter has a Mitchell guitar, which is the store brand for Guitar Center. It cost ~$120. She was drawn to that guitar, but there was another guitar made by Laguna that I thought had a better sound. It was ~$150. Both are well made instruments - not toys. The store also had a nice Yamaha.

There were many good well made choices. It's much different from when I was first learning back in the early 80's - beginner guitars back then were hard on the fingers and sounded horrible.

Especially if you are recovering from carpal tunnel issues, I think you have a good plan to head back out to the music store. I think you'll find a 3/4 size guitar refreshing.

Best of luck! Let us know how it goes for you.
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soody54
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09/06/2013 6:29 pm
Hi again, Maggior!

This is very reassuring! I'll be sure to check out these 3/4 guitars you mentioned. The prices are very reasonable, and it's encouraging that the sound isn't as diminished as I thought it might be. Great news.

I'll definitely keep you posted!

Thanks again!

Sue
# 6
maggior
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maggior
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09/06/2013 7:38 pm
The sound is good, but thanks to physics, you won't get the same full bodied sound out of a 3/4 guitar as a full size dreadnaught. To compensate and give the guitar a little more volume, they round out the back a bit so it isn't perfectly flat.

Just thought I'd mention that so you don't feel too let down when you hear the sound.

Since you are starting out, I think you should try to focus more on comfort, the guitar's ability to be tuned (no play in the tuners), stay in tune, and is properly intonated.

Good luck...and have fun!
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soody54
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soody54
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09/06/2013 8:10 pm
Yeah, I figured I'd lose some resonance with a smaller body, but you make a good point that comfort and playability is important at this point in my learning. I'll probably keep my Fender, but will be looking for a 3/4 at the same time.

Thanks again, Maggior!

Sue
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john of MT
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john of MT
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09/06/2013 10:23 pm
Hi Sue!

Holding the guitar differently may help. See the thread, "Resting the Guitar On My Leg", http://www.guitartricks.com/forum/showthread.php?t=38612&page=1&pp=7&highlight=classical+position .

I have what I consider to be a large dreadnaught and early into my start with GT lessons I switched to holding it in a way similar to classical guitar players. I thought it was more comfortable and I know I gained better/improved reach with the guitar in that position.

I sit when I practice and should I play standing up I find the guitar is in nearly the same position as when I practice. That can be a pretty big benefit too.
"It takes a lot of devotion and work, or maybe I should say play, because if you love it, that's what it amounts to. I haven't found any shortcuts, and I've been looking for a long time."
-- Chet Atkins
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soody54
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soody54
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09/07/2013 4:08 am
Wow, thanks!

John, this idea of holding the guitar more upright (like classical guitarists) is a very helpful one. I have actually noticed that when I start to get tired, I tend to hold the neck a bit higher, just so I can reach all the way around it more easily. So I'm glad to know that it's an acceptable solution, and YES, it works for me (now that I don't have to hold back!). Awesome.

I'll be sure to check out the link you so kindly provided, and will follow up with you on that, for sure!

I appreciate your suggestions very much, and am THANKFUL for this forum and for those of you so willing to help out! I hope I can pay it forward someday.

Blessings,

Sue
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soody54
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soody54
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09/07/2013 4:36 am
John, I forgot to mention....

Chet Atkins is my FAVORITE of all time. You have good taste!

LUCKY YOU that you live in such a beautiful state! Montana is on my bucket list, along with Wyoming.

Thanks again!
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john of MT
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09/08/2013 7:54 pm
Hi again, Sue!

First, you DO NOT want to get me started on how I came to love Montana and live in the state. We'll leave it at lucky me. :)

If you want to pursue the topic of holding guitars, proper posture (related), avoiding pain (also related) there are bunches of hits to be had from a Bing/Google search (after one sees the GT vids ;) ). I couldn't find the one I was looking for where the blogger wrote that 'the only one that thought he looked cool was his wife but that everybody thought his playing was cool.' But I did come up with this great thread on another forum discussing the 'classical vs. casual' issue, http://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1514357&goto=nextnewest . And I like this one, http://g4guitarstudentupdates.blogspot.com/2010/06/classical-sitting-position-for-optimal.html , because of the picture of the great John Petrucci...I hold both my electric and acoustic very, very close to the same way as in the pic and it shows what I meant by 'similar to classical guitar players.'

Again, changing the way I held guitar really helped me...
"It takes a lot of devotion and work, or maybe I should say play, because if you love it, that's what it amounts to. I haven't found any shortcuts, and I've been looking for a long time."
-- Chet Atkins
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soody54
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09/09/2013 1:02 pm
Well, now I want to know about how you got to Montana! lol! Feel free to let it all out!

Hey, this is great info. The link was super helpful, too. I found that many of your posts have covered this topic of how to hold the guitar and the issues that go along with that (especially for those of us with limited limbs, so to speak).

It's great to know I'm not alone with my beginner problems!

Thanks again!!

See you out there.

Sue
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soody54
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09/09/2013 1:07 pm
I think it's really sweet that the guy's wife "was the only one" who thought he looked cool playing in his "modified" position. LOL!! That's a good wife! (No doubt, he has always reassured her that her butt never does "....look big in this?") That's a good husband, too!
# 14
soody54
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09/09/2013 2:23 pm
THANK YOU for all the suggestions, John, because one of those links led me to a beautiful classical piece that I learned (a small part of it) almost 30 years ago, and have never been able to find it or play it since. I didn't even know the name of the music (Malaguena). As I flipped through classical positions from your link, I accidentally came across this video, showing a beautiful example of classic position, a talented classical guitarist (Michael Lucarelli), and a wonderful piece. I HAD to share. I WILL learn one this AGAIN if it kills me. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8B6jOUzBKYc

Everyone please enjoy... (gives me goosebumps). Classical will be my GO-TO position. I can REACH!!!

More info about this music...interesting!! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malague%C3%B1a_(song)

Thanks again,

Sue
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soody54
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09/09/2013 2:42 pm
I LOVE Charo. Us "older" folks will see that in 40+ years, she has NOT changed or aged one bit. Still the crazy, fun, outgoing, unabashed, sexy woman she always was. She has to be in her 70's by this time, I believe. But listen to her play....! A protégé of Xavier Cugat MANY years hence....her talent has not diminished. ENJOY her version of Malaguena. I think this one is my favorite. INTERESTING the positions I am noticing now with these amazing guitarists! I'm inspired! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mfVf7N8CJEA

(Now I just have to find Roy Clark's version!) The master of strings.

Thanks for tolerating me!

lol

Sue
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john of MT
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09/09/2013 4:01 pm
:D :D :D

The Wikipedia link you posted about "Malaguena" mentioned Dick Dale and his "Misirlou"...my first and always guitar hero and my favorite Dick Dale tune. Thanks for the memories...I'll be playing Dick Dale from my iTunes library this morning. :D Here is the earliest "Misirlou" video I know of, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZIU0RMV_II8 . Forty-plus years later this Nissan commercial appeared, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mGjTM7Lb6-Q but this, the intro to the "Pulp Fiction" soundtrack http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D5OHrQYwRac is truer to/or might be the first release in Dale's 1962 album, "Surfer's Choice".

And, yes, I remember Charo. Primarily from the Jerry Lewis MDA telethons, appearances on the old variety shows and "Laugh In".

Maybe someday I'll tackle "Misirlou" and "Maleguena"..."Misirlou" first. ;)

"Cuchi cuchi!" :D
"It takes a lot of devotion and work, or maybe I should say play, because if you love it, that's what it amounts to. I haven't found any shortcuts, and I've been looking for a long time."
-- Chet Atkins
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soody54
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soody54
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09/09/2013 5:12 pm
Wow! I never heard of Dick Dale, so I have to say I am IMPRESSED with this guy. That music is very familiar but I never knew the history or the cultural history of it (Egyptian!). It's BEAUTIFUL. Thanks for sharing, John!

Sue
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dowland58
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dowland58
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09/10/2013 3:39 pm
Originally Posted by: maggiorDon't worry about the "playing a kid guitar" bit.

If you see Dominic Miller playing Shape of my heart
often he uses a small guitar

(and He has very long fingers)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XqzFcOWPlWc
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soody54
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09/10/2013 4:23 pm
I loved that piece, Dowland....it's beautiful! I am learning about so many amazing musicians (by name) that I'd never heard of before. This is another one. I see your point about the guitar size, too. I was concerned about losing those lovely bass tones that (I thought) only came from a bigger body. There's so much to learn!

Thank you for taking the time to post on this again.

Blessings,

Sue
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