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Keys?


flipside05us
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Joined: 11/24/11
Posts: 5
flipside05us
Registered User
Joined: 11/24/11
Posts: 5
06/17/2013 11:20 pm
Hi Everyone,
I think I'm posting this in the right place, really enjoying this site and the lessons are great! But there's one thing that I really don't understand and want to real soon. So far I've learned the C major scale, B Major and the C minor scales and I enjoy practicing them a lot in all their different positions.
What I want to know is when for example a song is in the key of say C, does that mean I can just use the notes in the C major scale to jam along and it will go with the song?
Also how do I find what key is a song in, someone I think mentioned that the first note of the song is the key it is in, the first note being the first sound you here or the first word sung?
Sorry if this all seems too basic but I'm just a beginner and really want to learn.
Thanks in advance.
# 1
SebastBerg
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Joined: 02/01/10
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SebastBerg
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Joined: 02/01/10
Posts: 421
06/18/2013 2:43 am
Well if a song is in C and you play over the song with the C major scale, everything will sound good.
Now it dosnt meen you have to stay there. Sometimes going out of the scale intentionally, at the right moment, can add nice tensions in the song.
But generally, when beginning, your better of staying in the key (in the scale). Later on you can bend/break the rules.

Generally a song will start or/and finish on the key/root. You can also use your ears. If you listen to the song closely, you will ear a note here and there that sounds like its concluding something (melody/lick/riff, whatever).That's the root.

You can also get/find the chords of the song and that will give you the key.
Lets say you have a song with a chord progression that goes :
C#m, A, Bm

Using the Diatonic Major or minor chords formula you can find the key of the song.

Major diatonic chord formula:
Major, minor, minor, Major, Major, minor, diminished or I, ii, iii, IV, V, vi, vii
(Ex: Key of C the diatonic chords would be....C, Dm, Em, F, G, Am, Bdim)

Minor diatonic chord formula:
minor, diminished, Major, minor, minor, Major, Major or vi, vii, I, ii, iii, IV, V
(Ex: Key of Cm the diatonic chords would be....Cm, Ddim, Eb, Fm, Gm, Ab, Bb)


Let's take the progression's chords and place them in order using the Minor diatonic chord formula and placing the C#m as our first chord.
1st chord would C#m, 2nd chord would be D#dim, 3rd would be E, 4th F#m, 5th G#m, 6th A, 7th B....errrr....we got B minor in our progression and not B major so it cannot be in the key of C#m.

Lets try with A major using the major diatonic formula.
1st is A, 2nd is Bm, 3rd C#m, 4th D, 5th E, 6th F#m, 7th G#dim. Everything works so the song is in A.

Lets try with the 3rd chord just for fun. Bm with our diatonic minor formula.

1st Bm, 2nd C#dim....errr....we got C# min, so it can't be in the key of Bm.

It might seem complicated and long but all this becomes 2nd nature eventually. I hope this helps you.
# 2
flipside05us
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Joined: 11/24/11
Posts: 5
flipside05us
Registered User
Joined: 11/24/11
Posts: 5
06/18/2013 3:19 am
Hi SebastBerg,
Wow thank you for the detailed reply, certainly clears a couple of things up but because of my still limited knowledge I'm confused about the other stuff you mentioned.
But like you said it will all come eventually. Thanks for clearing a couple of things up for me now I can progress a bit further.
# 3
ChristopherSchlegel
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Joined: 08/09/05
Posts: 8,834
ChristopherSchlegel
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Joined: 08/09/05
Posts: 8,834
06/18/2013 1:41 pm
First, if you haven't already I greatly encourage you to check out Guitar Fundamentals 2 which starts with a lot of basic theory.

http://www.guitartricks.com/course.php?input=2
Originally Posted by: flipside05us
What I want to know is when for example a song is in the key of say C, does that mean I can just use the notes in the C major scale to jam along and it will go with the song?
[/quote]
That is the general idea. To be more specific, you target the chords in a progression as they happen, using the notes of a scale. I cover this idea in these tutorials on improvisation.

http://www.guitartricks.com/tutorial.php?input=876
http://www.guitartricks.com/tutorial.php?input=483
http://www.guitartricks.com/tutorial.php?input=491
[QUOTE=flipside05us]
Also how do I find what key is a song in, someone I think mentioned that the first note of the song is the key it is in, the first note being the first sound you here or the first word sung?

That is also covered in the above tutorials. The first note or chord of a song is not necessarily the root note or home key. However, quite often the last one is! :)

There is more on music theory & keys here.

http://www.guitartricks.com/tutorial.php?input=495
http://www.guitartricks.com/tutorial.php?input=835

Ask more if necessary, have fun!

Thanks, Seb for your in depth reply! :)

Christopher Schlegel
Guitar Tricks Instructor
Christopher Schlegel Lesson Directory

# 4
flipside05us
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Joined: 11/24/11
Posts: 5
flipside05us
Registered User
Joined: 11/24/11
Posts: 5
06/22/2013 6:43 pm
Wow thank you for replying, didn't expect to have one of the instructors to reply. I'm really enjoying your lessons right now, progress is slow but moving along. Becoming a member was definitely the right choice for me.
I'm doing the fundamentals 2 now so I will get to those links soon.
Thanks again.
# 5
ChristopherSchlegel
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Posts: 8,834
ChristopherSchlegel
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Joined: 08/09/05
Posts: 8,834
06/25/2013 1:09 pm
You are welcome for the reply! I try to make sure I answer all music theory questions.
Originally Posted by: flipside05usI'm really enjoying your lessons right now, progress is slow but moving along. Becoming a member was definitely the right choice for me.

Glad to hear you are working on GF2 & enjoying GT. :) Best of success with your guitar!

Christopher Schlegel
Guitar Tricks Instructor
Christopher Schlegel Lesson Directory

# 6

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