Downloading Copywritten Music?


Twangerdanger
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Twangerdanger
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11/10/2009 5:06 am
I never pay to go on any websites, period! The only password sites that I go on are Guitar Forum Websites. However, I have not bought a music CD or Video in years. I sometimes go to overseas websites in England, Japan, Germany, Denmark, etc. and get tons of mp3 files, games, and movies. Since US copyright laws can't enforce what other countries do, is it illegal for me to download and visit these sites in other countries, even if I don't have to enter any type of password to access the material?

If I pay my DSL bill every month, and I am not hacking into a site, can I not visit any site that I want without breaking laws. Who makes the Laws for the internet? I have no idea who owns the rights to the internet!

I have 3 music CD's of my own copy written material, that I busted my butt to write, record, and master. I was digging around the web a while back, and I found my CD's for sale in Taiwan, Japan, United Kingdom, Switzerland, and fifty other places. My CD's are copy written here in the US, but someone made copies and sent them all over the world without my permission.

How am I supposed to stop overseas governments from selling my music CD's, and every citizen in the world from downloading them for free? Take them to court? I've got $1000.00 and they have $100,000,000,000 dollars.

Here is the bottom line! If you put your music up for sale on the internet, before long, nobody will need to pay you for it anymore. Someone will make a copy, post it on an overseas website, and it is free for the world to have. It will never leave. It will circle the globe millions of times and you can never have it back. So, having said that, I don't feel guilty at all about downloading free music or videos from the internet anymore. Everybody downloads mine, I can't do anything about it!
# 1
jarler
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jarler
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11/10/2009 12:18 pm
As my mother used to ask: "If all your friends jumped off a bridge, would you follow?"

First of all, not everybody illegally downloads music. Secondly, as a musician that has work out there for sale, you should seriously feel ashamed of yourself for stealing the hard work of other musicians.

If someone offers something that you want, whether it be a service or a product, you should PAY for it. It's true that stealing music by downloading it is different than stealing a CD from a store, but it's still stealing. If you aren't willing to pay for it, then you should go without. It's that simple. If the music is good enough that I want to repeatedly listen to it, I buy it. If a website provides a service I see value in, I subscribe (like this one).

It doesn't matter what your excuses are. If you have no problems stealing the hard work of others, you are a sorry excuse for a human.

I'm not sure what you were hoping for by starting this thread. Someone to pat you on the back and say "it's okay that you're stealing from others"?
# 2
Razbo
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Razbo
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11/10/2009 12:56 pm
Hmmm, what was that thing about having cake and eating it...?


Originally Posted by: TwangerdangerSince US copyright laws can't enforce what other countries do, is it illegal for me to download and visit these sites in other countries, even if I don't have to enter any type of password to access the material?


Absolutely. You can get busted big time and/or a huge fine. I don't recall all the details, but there was a case in the past year or so where some lady (US citizen) got fined $400,000 for downloading stuff via a file sharing program. And it wasn't tons of stuff, either. I forget the number, but it was relatively small.

She was the recipient, she downloaded the stuff just like you. It doesn't matter what the program was. There might be some extradition laws that could hide you, but these days most countries are co-operating on that sort of thing.
...so ever since then, I always hang on to the buckle.
# 3
Twangerdanger
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Twangerdanger
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11/10/2009 2:23 pm
I would be more than happy to buy CD's again, but if I am going to lose thousands of dollars on overseas sales and free world downloads, I don't think I will ever buy another CD.

A lot of guys don't have "Radio Ready" music out yet, and you didn't spend a ton of money on production, recording gear, and software, so they don't understand. You think I am just ranting on about the screwed up music business. Just wait a few years when all your stuff gets stolen, then you will change your tune quick. If you never release your own CD's, then you have nothing to worry about. Imagine walking in your house after work or school and all of your guitars and amps are stolen. This is what I am talking about.
I started out selling my CD's at venues and online stores. It worked for a very short while, until people started making copies. Now I don't get paid a penny for them.

The point of this post is:

It is really sad for aspiring upcoming songwriter / musicians to know that they will not be paid for all of the years of work that they have done, unless the gig constantly. These days, a band don't usually get signed for very long, then the Labels start looking for the new fresh meat, so CD sales will be very important as a means of future income.

This is a warning to people posting music at online stores. All it takes is one CD to get into the wrong hands and your pockets will be empty. I don't know how to fix the problem, I looks like it's too late.
# 4
ChristopherSchlegel
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ChristopherSchlegel
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11/10/2009 3:07 pm
Originally Posted by: TwangerdangerSince US copyright laws can't enforce what other countries do, is it illegal for me to download and visit these sites in other countries, even if I don't have to enter any type of password to access the material?[/quote]
Legality is not the primary issue here. The primary issue is: is it moral?

And the answer is, of course, no, it is not. It is stealing, regardless of whether or not any given government decides to legislate against it & enforce their laws.
Originally Posted by: Twangerdanger
If I pay my DSL bill every month, and I am not hacking into a site, can I not visit any site that I want without breaking laws.[/quote]
You can visit any site you want, without hacking. You ought not download files without trading value for value at the discretion of the file creator/owner. Just because someone else has done the stealing for you doesn't mean you are not morally responsible.
Originally Posted by: TwangerdangerWho makes the Laws for the internet? I have no idea who owns the rights to the internet![/quote]
The government makes the laws for the internet. And some of them are good (laws that uphold private property rights) and some of them are bad (laws that violate private property rights, such as the upcoming potential Net Neutrality irrational laws).

The companies and people that invent, build, sell and buy the machinery and software that comprises the internet & web can make various rules about using their products and services. And they actually own the internet. Up to the line that you plug into. :) When it hits your computer, that it where you own part of the internet. Unless you have stolen material on your computer, then you do not morally own that part. That is the part you do not own, that you did not trade for, but rather stole.
Originally Posted by: Twangerdanger
I have 3 music CD's of my own copy written material, that I busted my butt to write, record, and master. I was digging around the web a while back, and I found my CD's for sale in Taiwan, Japan, United Kingdom, Switzerland, and fifty other places. My CD's are copy written here in the US, but someone made copies and sent them all over the world without my permission.

I am very sorry to hear you have been violated in this way. :( You have my deepest sympathies on this issue.

But, this means you of all people should understand the issues involved!
[QUOTE=Twangerdanger]
How am I supposed to stop overseas governments from selling my music CD's, and every citizen in the world from downloading them for free?

You can't physically stop them. But you can start by advocating, upholding the right ideas: private property must be traded for at the creator/owners discretion. Advocating that it is acceptable to steal if it is not "illegal", leaves you with no moral ground to stand on.

This is just one more disasterous consequence of post-modern culture which worships Karl Marx and all the collectivist nonsense that follows.
[QUOTE=Twangerdanger]Here is the bottom line! If you put your music up for sale on the internet, before long, nobody will need to pay you for it anymore.

This is simply not true. It does happen, but I also know many arists that make a living selling their music via the web.
[QUOTE=Twangerdanger] ... I don't feel guilty at all about downloading free music or videos from the internet anymore. Everybody downloads mine, I can't do anything about it!

:(

This is how civilization ends. I sincerely hope you reconsider this issue. Just because someone stole from you does not justify further stealing. It means we need a better world of ideas, a better culture, that respects, upholds and fights for private property rights.
Christopher Schlegel
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# 5
hunter1801
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hunter1801
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11/10/2009 10:56 pm
Originally Posted by: TwangerdangerI don't feel guilty at all about downloading free music or videos from the internet anymore. Everybody downloads mine, I can't do anything about it!


A thief gets angry at society because his stuff gets stolen......fail
# 6
RickBlacker
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RickBlacker
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11/10/2009 11:42 pm
Twangerdanger

I don't get it man... You're upset becasue others are out there taking from your pocket, yet you admit to doing the same. Seems like you're kind of shooting yourself in the foot here.
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# 7
JeffS65
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JeffS65
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11/11/2009 1:02 am
It is odd to decry the distribution of your own material by those that do not want to remunerate you but you, in the same post, point out that you will not pay for music. I am baffled at the contradiction within the space of a single post.

However, not my point.

It is the unwillingness to pay for new artist (or artists that are not formulaic) that has now cornered the music industry in to only putting releases that are 'sure things'. Whereas the industry standard deal in the 70's was a three album deal and up to you to make sales happen in those three, you now get one shot and you best work within a formula to do it. Because risk no longer pays, labels do not take them.

Risk payed in the 70's. Peter Frampton had, at best, a middling career before 'Comes Alive' was released as the biggest selling album ever to that date.

Risk nowadays does not. If the artist is mildly interesting but not an easily marketable entity, they will likely get passed over. There is no financial benefit in doing so.

People demonize the labels for this inability to cultivate new and interesting artists. Labels have always existed to make money. However, they were more apt to develop an artist because it could net a long term payoff.

People unwilling to pay for music is a prime culprit. A wholly uninteresting popular music landscape exists because people have not connected their own personal actions to the action of those whom they no longer pay for services (ie - labels).
# 8
RickBlacker
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11/11/2009 3:50 am
Jeff

I agree and disagree with you. I agree that we as consumers need to pay. I can imagine how the internet has hurt corp sales. No doubt about it.

Having said that. If the record labels would pup out solid music, catchy music stuff that was good, more people would pay. In the last 15 years there has only been a VERY small handful of bands that I listen to. And for those few, I do buy their music, I'm still old school and must have CDs rather than just download it. The rest, I don't even bother to rip off, find for free or simply bother to go out of my way to in any way shape or form obtain their music.

I buy what you say to some degree, but, Hollywood screwed the pooch when they killed heavy metal for grunge then to be followed up with nu metal.

I feel sorry for the artists, but not the record companies.
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# 9
Astrixx
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Astrixx
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11/11/2009 6:46 am
It's copyrighted not copywritten.
# 10
Razbo
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11/11/2009 1:12 pm
Just to continue the off-topic...

Probably most of what's been said is true. But I also think part of the problem is the sheer number of bands and artists out there these days. Back when I was a kid (Frampton's days lol), there were a dozen well known "big bands". I think back then music producers had to take chances, because they had no choice; there simply was not the "bandwagon" going on that there is today.

Now, anyone that can play 3 chords wants to form a band and make the big time. And some of them work hard to do it, approaching producers in droves, begging for a chance. The music companies can pick & choose only the most marketable.

I personally think the video era killed the music industry, anyway. It created the glam and the allure of big money and fame. Before that, it was hard working guys putting on live shows. Music was sold by sound, not sight.

Just my thoughts.
...so ever since then, I always hang on to the buckle.
# 11
RickBlacker
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11/11/2009 3:46 pm
Originally Posted by: Razbo
Now, anyone that can play 3 chords wants to form a band and make the big time. And some of them work hard to do it, approaching producers in droves, begging for a chance.


YEP. Todays rock is; boring, cookie cutter bullsh@t. Every guitar tone sounds identical, every singer sounds identical.

Rock in the 70's and 80's was fun to listen to. now, it's just something on the radio.

I will throw in my two band exception
1) 311
2) nickleback
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# 12

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