Breaking out of Pentatonic Jail

Hi, all - okay, I'm new here and joined because I'm stuck between learning the scales and using them to actually play music. I've watched "Pentatonic Jail" multiple times and understand the scale being used but I'm having a really hard time figuring out all the improv he's doing. How to get from scale to improv? Any comments/suggestions?

Originally Posted by: cadiqueenHi, all - okay, I'm new here and joined because I'm stuck between learning the scales and using them to actually play music.[/quote]
Hey and welcome to the site. :)
[QUOTE=cadiqueen]I've watched "Pentatonic Jail" multiple times and understand the scale being used but I'm having a really hard time figuring out all the improv he's doing. How to get from scale to improv? Any comments/suggestions?

What is your skill level? How much theory do you already know? Do you have other specific goals in mind?

Regarding getting from pentatonic scale to improv, see these tutorials:

http://www.guitartricks.com/tutorial.php?input=296
http://www.guitartricks.com/tutorial.php?input=217
http://www.guitartricks.com/tutorial.php?input=232
http://www.guitartricks.com/tutorial.php?input=244

http://www.guitartricks.com/tutorial.php?input=483
http://www.guitartricks.com/tutorial.php?input=491

Also, reviewing our fundamentals courses might be a good idea. Especially GF2 has many lessons covering the basics of how scales and chords relate to one another.

http://www.guitartricks.com/course.php?input=1
http://www.guitartricks.com/course.php?input=2

Hope this helps. Let us know how it goes for you!

Hi, Chris - hey, thanks - that was really helpful. I got through the first 3 Pentatonic Scales lessons tonight and I already sound a lot better. I've been through 3 or 4 teachers in the last year, and so far they've only confused me (although a couple were very good). I have felt stuck in the scales zone and now I'm actually making progress. Thanks again - I'll pick up more tomorrow night.

--Pat (aka: Cadiqueen)

Originally Posted by: cadiqueen... hey, thanks - that was really helpful. I got through the first 3 Pentatonic Scales lessons tonight and I already sound a lot better.

Godd deal! Glad those helped. Keep learning, practicing and having fun. Let us know how it goes or if you need any more help.

regarding the improv in general, once you can understand the system, the biggest part of the challenge is out of the way. For myself, when i learned (almost entirely self taught) i found the easiest way to learn how to start utilizing the system is to really pick an artist that excels at that sort of play. People often mention the very flashy player like eric johnson and vai, but also vaughan is an excellent artist to listen to and emulate to really start understanding how an improv playing style is achieved. Another group to listen to, somewhat more contemporary would be coheed and cambria...or at least their live recordings, which incorporate massive improv sections. Just hearing it done alone can give a lot of insight on how the note progression can work. Again, these are just things that worked for me, so dont take it as a tried and true method. Good luck!

Yes, you have to start thinking in a new way, and not the old scale way so much. You can start by looking at the pattern of a scale or mode without playing it yet. Then pick a grouping of notes from that scale, start small with like 4, and then try to rearrange them differently. See what little accents you can do as well.

Steve Vai has a trick that I use to practice with a lot, where you limit yourself to just two notes, for like 15 minutes. You can do what you want with those notes, but you can't play anything but those two notes. You'll get bored quickly, so you have to discipline yourself and you'll find a lot of creative ways to make those notes sound unique. When you're time's up - you'd be amazed at how your hands go crazy and start doing really imaginative things.

The reason seems to be that they've been denied for those 15 minutes. Practices like this help you to get out of that routine of playing the same notes over and over again. We all have patterns that we are comfortable playing, just like strumming the same chords every time. You have to work a little bit to stay creative, but it doesn't take much - hope this helps.

http://www.guitarspeedsecret.com

Originally Posted by: capitalalchemyYes, you have to start thinking in a new way, and not the old scale way so much. You can start by looking at the pattern of a scale or mode without playing it yet. Then pick a grouping of notes from that scale, start small with like 4, and then try to rearrange them differently. See what little accents you can do as well.

This is very good advice. I think that when we're learning a lot of scale patterns that span 2 or more octaves, it's important to keep in mind that you're not going to hear someone run through that scale pattern straight through in any type of music. It would just sound like an out of place exercise.

Breaking up scale patterns into smaller groups of notes is a great way to jump-start your improvising & creativity. Particularly when you learn a new lick, it's a good idea to try playing that same exact lick in as many different positions on the fretboard as you can. This kind of exercise helps with fretboard navigation, ear training, and just seeing the different places the same exact thing can be played on a guitar.

Originally Posted by: Ed Jalowiecki This kind of exercise helps with fretboard navigation, ear training, and just seeing the different places the same exact thing can be played on a guitar.

And really, playing the same thing/riff on a different place on the fretboard, will have/should have a totally different sound or punch. There are so many possibilties!