Scales and positions

Okay, I am going to ask an amazingly stupid question, but I am a little confused by something:

I've recently started trying to learn scales and position playing. Now I have learned the five positions on the minor pentatonic and expect to start on the major next. Question is though; can you slip between the two when trying to construct a solo? Does anyone actually do that? And why are some notes in a solo NOT one of the positions?

Like when you listen to SRV playing solos, I don't think he's staying inside the 'boxes' as it were but all the notes just seem to make sense.

Alright, I'm a dunce. I'll take my pointy hat and sit in the corner and wait for someone to enlighten me. :)

Thanks.

Hunter60,

After searching for some lessons discussing what you're asking I found a few but I`m not exactly sure if they will cover what you are looking for.

So, I would really like if you could look at some of the links below and tell me if you think they answer your question. If not, could you tell us what exactly is missing. I have a feeling a lot of guitar player are asking themselves the same question you are right now so if we can have your feedback that would help us a lot.

http://www.guitartricks.com/lesson.php?input=9951
http://www.guitartricks.com/lesson.php?input=10019
http://www.guitartricks.com/lesson.php?input=10023

http://www.guitartricks.com/lesson.php?input=8157

http://www.guitartricks.com/lesson.php?input=8991&s_id=116
http://www.guitartricks.com/lesson.php?input=9439&s_id=170

Actually SRV uses the blues scale and the shadow pent in alot of songs. He uses other tricks to but this is a signature SRV move. So for example If the song is in Amajor He would play the blues scale. This is basically the #1 Pentatonic (w/blues notes) played starting on the 5th fret A. He would also mix in the #1 pentatonic scale starting on the second fret. It's a little tricky to go back and forth between the 2 with style but that is the simplified idea behind the shadow blues. This can only be done if the song is in a major key though. And it works for all 5 parts of the pentatonic scale.

Hope that's clear.

Thanks a million. I appreciate your digging those out for me. I did go through them and I did pick up some of what was being taught. I do think I need to go back to the very start of the tutorials and work my way through them to help a little bit more.

From what I could tell, you can use notes from the Major inside the Minor pentatonics to add a little bit of something to it. Again, I will have to go through the whole series I think to fully appreciate and learn from it.

I guess when I listen to someone play a blistering lead, it seems like I can pick out some of the pentatonic structure but then there will be something in there that seems out of place mathematically and yet fit perfectly for the melody of the piece.

Does that make any sense at all? Sorry if these seem like idiotic questions but I this stuff confuses me to know end.

But I keep trying! :D

The major and minor shapes are the same, it's the order they stack in.

Play an A minor pentatonic scale... right... now, a C major pentatonic scale has the same notes, so you could play a C Major pentatonic scale over a backing track in the Key of A minor, and it would work....

Chromaticism - you can play pretty much any note.... it's about how you resolve a phrase. Try it - put on an A minor backing track, and play any 4 notes within 1 octave, and finish on a chord tone (A, C# or E for this example)...

There are players who claim to know nothing about scales etc, they just play what works - Ritchie Kotzen is the best example I can think of. Playing his stuff makes no technical sense sometimes, but it sounds cool... :cool:

all the positions show you all the notes in a particular key.

they dont necessarily tyell you which mode you are in. your note choice decides that. eg if your notes are c d e f g a b and you play c's a lot your in c ionion. if you play a lot of g's your in g aelion. a lot of b's b locrainion.

i have simplefied the note chice thin above, but you get the jist.


edit; a aolion not g

i feel like an idiot

Another way of mixing it up between positions is to use the open-string scales - of course, this only works if you are playing in E, A, D, G or B! You can use these for those big slides, or for pedal-point licks and patterns.

Originally Posted by: hunter60Okay, I am going to ask an amazingly stupid question, but I am a little confused by something:

I've recently started trying to learn scales and position playing. Now I have learned the five positions on the minor pentatonic and expect to start on the major next. Question is though; can you slip between the two when trying to construct a solo? Does anyone actually do that? And why are some notes in a solo NOT one of the positions?

Like when you listen to SRV playing solos, I don't think he's staying inside the 'boxes' as it were but all the notes just seem to make sense.

Alright, I'm a dunce. I'll take my pointy hat and sit in the corner and wait for someone to enlighten me. :)

Thanks.

Scales, scales??? Is that guitar lesson stuff. Strangely enough, the way to play guitar scales has nothing to do with the box style. I know this sounds weird but the box style was created by blues and country players for working around chords. The lead guitar players that came along realised taht this was an easy way to riff over the chord progressions so adopted it. Soem of the box styles in 3rd fifth and seventh positions seem to incorporate the scales but if you look at the guitar and picture the scales, once you get off of the first position there really are only 3 in total. Each position is as einstein says reletive. This means when you play a scale in the second position starting on low E thwhich would be the scale of F the F# is only a matter of using the same fingering one fret up. The best thing is work out the fretting for scales on the top three strings first.get them down so it becomesw second nature the other three strings will fall in to place quite easilly. PLaying a solo however isn't technical it's soulful. I have never had a lesson so i only play my own style. Guess work mostly.

Minor and major scales are the same patterns just in different positions on the neck. For example the A minor pentatonic ,on the fifth fret, is the same as the A Major pentatonic on the second fret. Once you earn all the scales its easy to switch between Major and Minor scales. I'm not sure about using both in the same song as it is probably similar to key changes which are tricky to make work well.