Where do I go from here?

I have been attempting to learn guitar for about a year now. I have learned from videos and I know all my major and minor scales, pentatonic scales, chords, chord progressions, etc... I can play songs from tabs, and I'm taking a class on how to read music. The instructor tells me that it will help me understand the music and how to learn for myself. However, I met this kid at Guitar Center that just learned to play by himself. He was incredible. He was playing Hendrix and Van Halen, etc.. He knew all the tricks and he was shredding it up!!!

My question is for all you professionals and great guitar players out there, "Am I doing the right thing?" Should I stay in the class and learn to read music or what should I do to learn and get better? How do I learn the effects and tricks and all that stuff? I know that sometimes you have to get lucky and come across someone who'll take you under their wing, however, that's not the case here.

Thanks in advance:

Frank

That question is going to get a lot of opinions as answer's. There really is no straight up answer. It's all opinion. I myself am self taught, which to me, makes you develop your own style. I can't read music, just tabs, but I can play Eruption.....You don't have to be able to read music to be good or great. My opinion of taking lessons is that your going to learn the style of the person teaching you. But at the same time, taking lessons takes the guess work out of learning. You get a clear path on what to do in certain situations. If your wanting to learn theory, the best thing to do is take lessons, but if your wanting to develop a unique style, I'd suggest keep on learning on your own.....

I think that the value of lessons will be dependent upon your teacher and your relationship with them. A good teacher can help develop your style whilst showing you the quickest way from A to B, avoiding "bad technique" that is limiting speed etc.

I have been playing for 20+ years and took 6 months worth of lessons (for the first time) about 3 years ago. It was quite a rewarding experience and taught me the basics of music theory. Some of this has been helpful!

However a bad teacher... bin them fast !

Me, well... having got the modes and various minor scales down, I will expand my chord vocabulary and finally learn to read music via multi octave arpeggios. I am starting to expand my tapping also and that is an area I want to spend some time on. I can do most of this with a book however, if I manage to find a good teacher, I can just speed it up a bit ! (bad pun I know !)

Originally Posted by: JFRICKThat question is going to get a lot of opinions as answer's. There really is no straight up answer. It's all opinion. I myself am self taught, which to me, makes you develop your own style. I can't read music, just tabs, but I can play Eruption.....You don't have to be able to read music to be good or great. My opinion of taking lessons is that your going to learn the style of the person teaching you. But at the same time, taking lessons takes the guess work out of learning. You get a clear path on what to do in certain situations. If your wanting to learn theory, the best thing to do is take lessons, but if your wanting to develop a unique style, I'd suggest keep on learning on your own.....

First, I'd like to thank you for you input, it is really appreciated. Secondly, let me ask you, how does one build their style. Basically, I am asking if you do not have a teacher, how do you learn how to piece together chords, notes, arpeggios, etc... into forming songs and developing a unique style.
For example, I try to use my scales, chords, and arpeggios into creating melodies and tunes, but most of the time it sounds horrible. What I'm getting at is for example, James the lead singer and songwriter for Metallica couldn't point out a note on the guitar by name (self-admitted in an interview that I saw) nor read sheet music if his life depended on it, however, the guy creates great music. He writes almost all of his string parts for all of his songs. My question is this, how does he and other like him do it???
This is a question that haunts me all the time. Maybe you could shed some light on it.

Thanks again:

Frank

How does James do it? Well, he writes really simple songs, lol! He uses mainly power/simple chords.

You can really only learn to write songs by practicing writing songs and working on your theory. You'll learn what works well with what after time. Teachers can only expedite this process.

About developing your style, that just comes with time. You'll play thousands of licks; the ones you like will stick with you, the ones you don't will get removed from your repetoire...

Slash learned all by himself. Thats not to say that since slash did it, we can all do it. Everybody is different, if lessons are working for you put it on the side and do other things....just play songs and you will learn that way. Its important though to have some feedback. I believe a good mix of both would be best.

Being someone who has been self taught, the only thing i regret is someone who could give me feedback to make the process faster, but hey, thats why we have the great people here at Guitar tricks! :D .

Finally advice, its about fun and exploration of your skills, but without fun its nothing.

I think the right path or should say the way to go about it is, never stop learning. Continously try different things. Theres more than a life-times worth of knowledge in music, so don't stop learning. Delve into theory, learn tricks from different guitarists (guitartricks is a gold mine for that), learn other's songs and try to understand them (the arrangement, scales and modes, harmonies, and so on).

Some people can learn on there own and some can't. Having someone there with experience will help you, especially with technique problems or just any questions you may have along the way. Learning on your own is good too, but I would suggest getting books and some videos so that you have something to work on.

Learning to read music definitely helps, I myself have gotten into that lately. I have definitely seen improvement, more in my comprehension and grasp on what I'm playing. I feel like I've finally gotten the missing piece in place.

As for songwritting, I think of it as a craft. The more you know or more tools you have the easier it is to punch out songs.

Just keep at it man

Hey guys, I'm sorry to interrupt, this is my first time here and the title of this thread sounded exactly like the kind of help I needed so I thought that I would jump in.
I've been playing guitar for about a year and know alot of chords and some scales but I have no idea how to jump from one to the other smoothly or even where on the fretboard to do it at. I have a few songs that I've been working on and just can't seem to get this next step down. Any suggestions on how I can do this or where to find this info without having to go take lessons?

Originally Posted by: alkub3Hey guys, I'm sorry to interrupt, this is my first time here and the title of this thread sounded exactly like the kind of help I needed so I thought that I would jump in.
I've been playing guitar for about a year and know alot of chords and some scales but I have no idea how to jump from one to the other smoothly or even where on the fretboard to do it at. I have a few songs that I've been working on and just can't seem to get this next step down. Any suggestions on how I can do this or where to find this info without having to go take lessons?

First of all, Just keep on trying. its a large step in playing guitar. Dont expect to be able to play things perfectly smooth. Just keep on playing and playing. It would also help if you could find a friend that lives near you that is pretty good at guitar, because while you play he can give you pointers to improve your specific playing style, and point out the small things that you are doing wrong.

Try first writting song in just one key. So if it's A minor, play your melody in the A minor scale and use the chords of the A minor key. Alittle study in music theory will help you alot here. When it comes to making two ideas come together smoothly. The key is to keep one aspect of the first idea and use it in the second idea. Like a beginning rhythm. If the first idea starts with a rhythm like "da da dada da", repeat the rhythm in the second idea. Take a listen to some riffs in rock and metal music. A riff is usually repeated four times, the first three might be the same, while the fourth starts the same, but the ending is different from the first three. It might not be exactly as I described everytime, but there is always something similar going on.

Also not every part has to be smooth into the next, you don't always want that. A dramatic change can really spark up the intensity of a song. Just don't over do it. ;)

Also a good first step for songwritting is to take songs that you like. Then write a song that is very similar, but using your own chords and scales. This is a great way to learn the inner workings of songs. Don't worry about copywrite laws, unless you write up something, sell it, get a deal, and blah blah. Use this as practice.

I do suggest reading up on some music theory, you'll find the answers there. It won't tell you how to write the perfect song but it will put alot of things into perspective. And keep practicing...

Originally Posted by: noticingthemistakeif it's A minor, play your melody in the A minor scale and use the chords of the A minor key

How do you find the chords of a given key? Is that where the circle of 5ths thing comes into play?

Originally Posted by: LeedoggHow do you find the chords of a given key? Is that where the circle of 5ths thing comes into play?

Each note in a scale can form a triad. Take A minor. Starting with A, you form a triad. To form a triad, start with A, skip the next note (B), C, skip the next note (D), E. You have A C and E. Which forms an A minor triad. If you do this with each note, you get.

A C E - A minor (i)
B D F - B diminished (iio)
C E G - C major (III)
D F A - D minor (iv)
E G B - E minor (v)
F A C - F major (VI)
G B D - G major (VII)

So the chords in the A minor key are:
Am Bdim Cmaj Dm Em Fmaj G maj

Thats how you get the chord for a key.

All minor keys are the same.

i iio III iv v VI VII

Although the minor key has a much better scale for coming up with chords. The harmonic minor scale.

Creates this: i iio III+ iv V VI viio

Originally Posted by: noticingthemistake
A C E - A minor (i)
B D F - B diminished (iio)
C E G - C major (III)
D F A - D minor (iv)
E G B - E minor (v)
F A C - F major (VI)
G B D - G major (VII)

What do the Roman Numerals mean? Sometimes I'll be looking something up, and it'll say to play, for example, I,IV,V. Is that referring to the chords above that you have listed?

yep .................

So say I had a little melody going in the key of C minor and I wanted to find the chords for it (C minor). Is this right:

C Minor:
C D D# F G G# A# C


C D# G -- C Minor (i)
D F G# -- D Diminished (iio)
D# G A# -- D# Major (III)
F G# C -- F Minor (iv)
G A# D -- G Minor (v)
G# C D# -- G# Major (VI)
A# D F -- A# Major (VII)


Thus my C minor chords are: Cm, Ddim, D#maj, Fm, Gm, G#maj, and A#maj

Did I apply the formula correctly thus far?

Aside from playing around with these chords (which I fully plan on doing), can you give me any pointers of some good progressions to use that will fit my melody? The melody itself has a dark, brooding, and solemn quality about it if that helps.

What if instead of three notes for chord construction I used four, such as:

C D# G A#
D F G# C
D# G A# D
F G# C D#
G A# D F
G# C D# G
A# D F G#


Is this a legal maneuvre so to speak? All I did was skip another note because I noticed I had room before I got to the octave again. Do these chords have names?

Yeah, but first. In a key, there is only one of each letter in a scale. So instead of "C D D# F G G# A# C". It's this "C D Eb F G Ab Bb C". I know there the same note but writting them this way with help you recognize the closely related keys.

Since the melody is dark. You may want to go with the C harm. minor scale to get your chords instead of C minor.

Any melody can be harmonized with just the chords I IV and V. As a beginner I would suggest trying to work around these chords first, and limit the use of the other chords. Subbing the V chord with the viio (B D F) chord will add dark tonality. Like i - iv - vii (instead of V) - i - iv - V.

When you add another third to a triad you form a 7th chord. In C harm. minor, you get C Eb G B. A Cm/maj7 chord. I think you'll find this a nice harmony for a dark melody since this chord has a scary sound. Used alot in horror music.

Thanks so much for your help there dude. Did you go to a music school or have you just been at this sorta thing for awhile. Anyways, thanks for letting me pick your brain and I hope I haven't annoyed you with all these questions, but I've really learned alot just from this thread.

I got a book coming in the mail called "Fretboard Logic SE" by Bill Edwards, do you recommend this book or perhaps any others that will help me learn theory better?

I took 4 yrs of theory and I still study it after school. Theory for me though is academic not practical. Theory itself is just the study of what has been done by certain people (Bach, Beethoven, Debussy) in the hope of understanding what works. The books I started off with as a beginner were Ottman's "Elem. and Advanced Harmony". I highly recommend these books cause they start with the very practical all the way up to modern and more advanced practices from guys like Stravinsky and Debussy. Simply put, these books are easy to comprehend. The bulk of the books cover harmony, but also hit important notes on melody, rhythm, form, and more. The books also contain exercises, drills, and techniques which I believe is very important because to fully grasp theory you must practice using it. Reading about it alone just won't give you the full understanding of it. These books show you how to do it and then asks you to do it with there examples and then with stuff that you write. On the negative side both these books will cost you about 150 bux. However they are a great start and you'll definitely see improvement in your muscial ability once you have completed them.

Paul Hindemith's books are also very good, however I think it is alittle harder to understand than Ottman's books. Also the bulk of his books use his own music as examples. However Hindemith is a good composer, it's better to learn from a variety of composers. Ottman goes through several of some well-known composers.

The book you ordered I have not looked at, so I couldn't give you an honest opinion.

i dont get that

Originally Posted by: f_medinaI am asking if you do not have a teacher, how do you learn how to piece together chords, notes, arpeggios, etc... into forming songs and developing a unique style.
For example, I try to use my scales, chords, and arpeggios into creating melodies and tunes, but most of the time it sounds horrible. What I'm getting at is for example, James the lead singer and songwriter for Metallica couldn't point out a note on the guitar by name (self-admitted in an interview that I saw) nor read sheet music if his life depended on it, however, the guy creates great music. He writes almost all of his string parts for all of his songs. My question is this, how does he and other like him do it???
This is a question that haunts me all the time. Maybe you could shed some light on it.

Thanks again:

Frank

Hey man, if i get your question, you are asking how to write amazing pieces of music, like how to write a song pretty much right?
Well, that happens to be not such a simple answer. First of all you can't teach someone how to write songs, if it was so simple we would all be Jimmy Page. So i will try to give you some advice thou on how to write songs, ok, but first i got to tell you about my freind. I have this kid in my class that is like this amazing artist(him being an artist is only an important peice of information later on in the story), like this dude is amazing and he learnt a bit of guitar. And one day he came up to me and is like "hey kutzki i wrote a song, listen" and he played his song. It was very nice and dandy, like the chords fit together and everythin and it wasnt a bad song and i was just like "that song has no feeling man its like, you are dead weres your soul and the feeling in that man!"
He didnt get it so i now go back to him being an artist(i draw also) anyways so i am like when you draw a picture what do you do. you dont just take a blue and take a red and put them nexted to each other and you get a blue and red ball! you take the red and you mix it into a blue sky and you draw clouds that are from fire or whatever and you put some passion into the picture. You dont just draw a house. You draw a house with windows and doors and ect!
Well the next song he wrote was amazing! REAL FEELING
and if you can put feeling into a piece of music it will song good even if you have been playing for 6 months. If you put some of your soul into the piece it will come out very awesome. This is if your soul is good and you have pure intention of course. Like these people who just play to be cool i don't mind them but they should never write music.
I hope this helped at all cus it took me a long time to type this up haha
and i have only been playing for 2-3 years and i ant that good but the songs i play for everyone i have been told they enjoy it
i never took lessons
lessons don't affect your writting just your technigue a bit and they can give you a backup in theory which will broden your creative ability which is really useful
i get peoples compliments and you just gota put in some soul man thats really the key
listen to some floyd stuff some solos and you will get it
theres nothing in those solos but his soul man
k man i hope this helped you man
later