The current forum sucks: Suggested improvements


JJ90
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JJ90
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02/26/2017 10:27 pm

Hi everyone,

It has been a while since I visited this forum. Reason for my lack of involvement on the GT forum is that I find the current forum has so many omissions and lack of features it makes it not user-friendly. In short: the forum sucks. I hate to be ranting since I'm not usually the type of person to do this. Along with others I already made clear my opinion and gave some feedback regarding the lack of features in another post. But that has been over [u]8 months and no additional improvements or features have been implemented since.[/u]

For those who don't know: Last year GuitarTricks "upgraded" their forum from the old forum. GT was forced to replace the old forum with the current one due to out of date software. Although perfectly understandable, I think GT made the wrong decision to release the new forum that has A LOT less features and capabilities. In my opinion they should have prioritized maintaining all the features the old forum had, and making sure they were present in the new forum, instead of making everything look nice.

I want to use this forum thread to suggest some serious improvements, point GT at where features are lacking and how it can transform in a functional and user-friendly forum again. So anyone is free to jump in and suggest additional improvements.

IMPORTANT IMPROVEMENTS[br]

- Basic indicators and icons: This is an absolute must! The old forum, and ANY general forum has indicators and icons that show which forum sections and threads have new posts, which forum threads are considered "hot" and even the ones I'm subscribed to / replied to. Additionally it also needs to show which posts are sticky and which threads are locked. The current forum looks clean, with this it will be possible with the blink of an eye to see this. The "Show new posts" feature is too basic and does not suffice.

- Messaging system: According to Ben Martin this feature should have been still present with the new forum but it got removed for some reason. Again, ANY general forum has this feature to send private messages to other members. I've used this feature several times with the old forum to discuss some things with other members, such as my experiences using GT in combination with a private guitar teacher. This also is an absolute must!

- Reputation system: Most forums have a reputation system in which people can give reputation to other peoples posts. This works both ways: Users can see which members and posts are considered useful, but also for GT staff, since they will be able to see if people agree with a suggestion or idea, or even when there is grounded criticism and feedback.

- Ability to generate polls: Polls are a nice way to involve the community and get a discussion going. Again, ANY general forum has this feature. This should also be implemented!

- More text options when posting a reply or creating a thread: The current option are incredibly basic. Things that could be improved are the ability to outline text right, center or left. Furthermore it should be possible to insert ordered and unordered lists. Unordered last use bullets, and ordered lists use numbers from 1 to... You get the idea. Most forums also have a message icon / emoticon that can be selected when creating a thread.

LESS IMPORTANT IMPROVEMENTS

- See users online and birthdays: Usually at the bottom of the main forum page it can sometimes be fun to track how many people are online, and whilst looking at a post which user is reading a thread. Most forums also have an indicator next to a persons name in a post to show if they are online. Additionally, in past years I have send several happy birthdays to other forum members.

- Preview posts: Always helpful to preview your posts to show how they will look like once posted, and additionally to check for any spelling mistakes.

- A "help" icon: To help new forum members or others with basic information on how to use the forum and a legend which shows the meaning of all indicators and icons once implemented. The latter should also be present at the bottom of each forum section.

These are my suggested improvements so far. Again I do not like to rant and rage but it baffles me how GT argues they keep the forum under development but there has not been a single improvement or added feature for the last 8 months. As someone who also has some IT experience it has frustrated me immensly! I do not hope GuitarTricks did this to save cost because in my opinion a vivid and user-friendly forum is incredibly important! For me it is reason enough to not re-activate my subscribtion, because I felt that after my previous remarks GT did nothing with my or other peoples feedback. And I do not wish to bash GuitarTricks. [u]The only reason I post this is that I want the forum to be good.[/u]

Again, others are free to join in and provide additional feedback. Additionally, I would also like to know from GT staff what they plan on doing with the forum development. If it remains as basic and featureless as it is now I will not be returning here, nor will I subscribe to GT again since there are alternatives.

Hope you guys appreciate this long post.

JJ


# 1
Ben Martin
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Ben Martin
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02/28/2017 12:05 am

Hey JJ, thanks for the post. I can tell you took a lot of time to list out everything you want in the forum and I appreciate that.

It's not completely true that we haven't been working on the forum. We added the newest posts page, subscriptions to threads, post previews, an improvement to the avatar system, and a handful of other things that people said they wanted.

But you're right, we haven't added back all the features you mention like birthdays, private messaging, etc.

We are a pretty small team here, and the reality is that we don't have the resources to develop all the features everyone requests as fast as we want. You want us to bring back a happy birthday email, while most people want us to go get more songs and produce more video lessons.

Sorry to dissapoint you with the progress! We are working on it at the fastest pace we can.


# 2
maggior
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maggior
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02/28/2017 1:30 pm

Forum activity here has dropped to all time lows also. When I first joined, this was quite an active community. Slowly I've seen people fade away and no longer post.

For me, what made this site great wasn't just the lessons and the instructors but the vibrant user community. It was great to communicate with my fellow guitar and music nuts!! There are other places on the Inernet where I get that interaction, but it's still sad to see it gone from GuitarTricks. I don't know if it's a sign of fewer GT subscribers or the fact that forum usage has just dropped.

I've read elsewhere that forums are becoming a thing of the past...forums are becoming what MySpace has become :). I've seen it suggested that Facebook fills the void left by forums, but I don't see it....Facebook groups are too chaotic.


# 3
JJ90
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JJ90
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02/28/2017 4:21 pm

I appreciate your reply Ben. It was interesting to hear that at GT the team is small and the resources are therefore also limited. But I'm still standing by my opinion that this forum needs to be reinvigorated by adding a lot more features. It is good to know that you are still working on forum development but I'm afraid it is too little too late. As Maggior rightfully notices the amount of activity has dropped hugely! This is a huge bummer, and I think this is largely due to the current forum version. I would appreciate it if you could let us know which features and improvements (even from my list) the team is planning to implement, even on the long term.

As for Maggior: I could not agree with you more! The vibrant community on the GuitarTricks forum was one of the reasons I kept returning here on a daily basis. Loads of positive vibes and interesting discussions going on. I really miss it quite a bit, which was for me the reason to start this thread. And yes, I still prefer a forum over a Facebook group. Thanks for your reply :-)

JJ


# 4
john of MT
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john of MT
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02/28/2017 4:53 pm

Hi guys... I just spent an hour typing my response to this thread. For the first time in my experience, I clicked SUBMIT, was taken to a page where it asked if I was a robot. Upon clicking 'no', that page closed and I was taken back to the the forum where my post was no where to be found. Sigh.

So I will try a more brief version...and save what I write before posting.

While I wouldn't use the term "sucks" I agree with much of what JJ90 says. The change in the member profile page was a loss. For me, there was an enhanced sense of community when I learned more about my co-members. The inclusion of birthdate, location, interests, guitar/music experience and other commentary was great. It helped me understand where a member was coming from, sometimes explained awkward writing, tempered my response to some snarky remark about one of my favored, 50-year old tunes, or added a sparkle to the realization that the member was at some place I use to cruise and love.

I know GT resources are limited. But I don't understand how the previous member profile page takes much...something to be (optionally) filled out upon joining and changed on a member's whim. But I must be in a very small minority. When I long-ago posted this same comment Ben responded with an open question to others, 'what do you think?' Last I saw, there were no responses.

There are other things that I have expressed disappointment over or provided suggestions. Which leads to polls...

Polls...OMG...polls! Something I've suggested for much of my nearly decade-long membership. I feel even stronger about 'em now because, after the remake of GT, I wondered if the changes were designed by guitarists or users of GT. And especially wondered if any guitarists or users where consulted before the changes. However, the years-long experience with the Song Request Forum portends little hope for response to polls.

I love GT. It's been a boon to my lifestyle and quality of life. I consider myself a defender of GT and jump in when I think someone's critical language is too strong or out of touch. But..."there's room for improvment."

john


"It takes a lot of devotion and work, or maybe I should say play, because if you love it, that's what it amounts to. I haven't found any shortcuts, and I've been looking for a long time."
-- Chet Atkins
# 5
john of MT
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john of MT
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02/28/2017 4:54 pm

Whew. The second try above worked. But I still got the 'I'm not a robot' page. Something new and permanent?


"It takes a lot of devotion and work, or maybe I should say play, because if you love it, that's what it amounts to. I haven't found any shortcuts, and I've been looking for a long time."
-- Chet Atkins
# 6
Joe105
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Joe105
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03/01/2017 12:39 am

I quite like this forum but I don't understand why so many people view the topics but don't give any input. I can't believe they have no views or thoughts on the posts submitted.

I really miss a good profile page so that you know a bit about who you are talking to. I think this is really important and should be addressed ASP.

Joe.


# 7
JJ90
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JJ90
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03/01/2017 5:21 pm

Hey John,

Bummer that your full reply wasn't posted, would have loved to read that one. Fantastic suggestion about the "Profile" page! I fully agree with you and Joe105 that is more fun to learn some personal things about individual forum members such as their interests, favorite bands, their gear, and where they are from. I also think this shouldn't take up that much time for GT to add. Additionally, I also can fully relate to the thing about polls. I didn't even think about it, but you rightfully suggest that it can also be used for GT to ask for feedback regarding new features or overhauls. Furthermore it can also help to vote for your favorite songs on which GT is trying to gain a license. I also question if the GT staff actually consulted users and guitar players before launching both the new forum and the site overhaul. In my opinion the old site also had great accesability in terms of easily jumping to any kind of lesson due to the links on the left column. This can still be improved with the current lay-out.

Just in short: [u]GT could do a lot more with polls or surveys, or even a forum thread by asking for feedback.[/u]

I appreciate everyone jumping on here to share their experiences. I hope this helps to make the GT-staff more aware of what users want.

JJ


# 8
john of MT
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john of MT
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03/01/2017 7:37 pm

The disappointing thing about the member profile page is that I'm not calling for something new but merely suggesting it goes back to what it was. The informative member profile was one of the features lost in the GT redesign.

I want to make clear than my letdown is not with the instructors but with the structure and user friendliness of the site/forum. I know that GT designers are working hard to make it what it can be but my priorities obviously differ from those on the other end of the site.

If nothing else, studying guitar has improved my patience.


"It takes a lot of devotion and work, or maybe I should say play, because if you love it, that's what it amounts to. I haven't found any shortcuts, and I've been looking for a long time."
-- Chet Atkins
# 9
JJ90
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JJ90
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03/01/2017 11:01 pm
Originally Posted by: john of MT

I want to make clear than my letdown is not with the instructors but with the structure and user friendliness of the site/forum.

This! Even though I'm not a full access member anymore I have always been highly satisfied with the lesson quality and instructors. Both the site and forum took one step forward and two steps back.


# 10
john of MT
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john of MT
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04/22/2018 5:50 pm

So here we are again.

Obviously for the first time in a long time, I tried to Private Message a member... nope, still not back. As are the other features that were dropped and the excellent suggestions for new features still not adopted.

I still won't use the term "sucks" but "disappointed" is a good word choice. My 8th grade English teacher would mark it, +2.

john

(see... even the emoticons are inferior to the old ones)


"It takes a lot of devotion and work, or maybe I should say play, because if you love it, that's what it amounts to. I haven't found any shortcuts, and I've been looking for a long time."
-- Chet Atkins
# 11
manXcat
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manXcat
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10/15/2019 10:58 pm

This needs bumping.

I'm with you John of MT. I'd like to give my WhatsApp contact details to a select couple of other members, but don't want to post that or other private info publically here where everything internet is archived forever in a Google search world.

Forget the birthday reminder silliness, likes and other churlish Farcebook wannabe flim flam, but private messaging as a [u]basic prerequisite[/u] in the Guitar Tricks forum is [u]long overdue[/u].

There's not a freeware forum app out there which doesn't have it as a inherent BASIC feature.

February 2017's response, "We are working on it at the fastest pace we can" lacks credibility in October 2019 by observation.

Just sayin'..


# 12
matonanjin2
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matonanjin2
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10/16/2019 4:16 pm
Originally Posted by: maggior

Forum activity here has dropped to all time lows also. When I first joined, this was quite an active community. Slowly I've seen people fade away and no longer post.

For me, what made this site great wasn't just the lessons and the instructors but the vibrant user community. It was great to communicate with my fellow guitar and music nuts!! There are other places on the Inernet where I get that interaction, but it's still sad to see it gone from GuitarTricks. I don't know if it's a sign of fewer GT subscribers or the fact that forum usage has just dropped.

I've read elsewhere that forums are becoming a thing of the past...forums are becoming what MySpace has become :). I've seen it suggested that Facebook fills the void left by forums, but I don't see it....Facebook groups are too chaotic.

I agree with everything thing that maggior just said, above. And I can say this with some authority. I was a relatively active member here as I was going through Fundamentals 1. There was a vibrant, active community here. My learning path then took me a different direction as I worked on my Blues learning rather than go through the Blues path here. (Not due to any disatisfaction here) I was absent from here for many months.

When I came back the forum is a waste land. I have tried my part to do some posting. But it remains very inactive.

I'm not sure that I agree that forums are dying. FB groups may have some impact. But I am active in a few other groups, I waste a lot of time there, and am an admin on one, and see a lot of activity. The PRS guitars forum (https://forums.prsguitars.com/) probably has hundreds of posts per day. Look at te activity of My Les Paul! I realize that those are guitar model centric forums. But I am also member of a few other forums, teaching forums, thet would be considered competitive to here. So I won't mention those names. They have comparatively multiples of activity.

I fully realize and appreciate that there is limited time on the part of teachers here and, of course, limited resources that they feel they need to allocate elsewhere. And certainly, nor do I understand the business model. But I would think that membership and activity here would feed subscriptions to the lessons. If someone here was raving about a lesson I would certainly think it would encouraged some others to consider said lesson.

As it stands, with the exception of the occasional song I'm working on, I am most likely going to be absent again from here.


[u]Guitars:[/u] 2014 PRS Santana, 2013 PRS Paul's, 2009 PRS Hollowbody, 1972 Gibson ES-325, 2012 Fender Strat American Standard, 2012 Yamaha Pacifica, Martin M-36, Martin 000-15M, Seagull S6 Classic[br][u]Amps:[/u] Fender Blues Junior III, Boss Eband JS-10, Line 6 POD 500X, Quilter Microblock 45

# 13
Guitar Tricks Admin
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Guitar Tricks Admin
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10/16/2019 5:12 pm
Originally Posted by: matonanjin2
Originally Posted by: maggior

Forum activity here has dropped to all time lows also. When I first joined, this was quite an active community. Slowly I've seen people fade away and no longer post.

For me, what made this site great wasn't just the lessons and the instructors but the vibrant user community. It was great to communicate with my fellow guitar and music nuts!! There are other places on the Inernet where I get that interaction, but it's still sad to see it gone from GuitarTricks. I don't know if it's a sign of fewer GT subscribers or the fact that forum usage has just dropped.

I've read elsewhere that forums are becoming a thing of the past...forums are becoming what MySpace has become :). I've seen it suggested that Facebook fills the void left by forums, but I don't see it....Facebook groups are too chaotic.

I agree with everything thing that maggior just said, above. And I can say this with some authority. I was a relatively active member here as I was going through Fundamentals 1. There was a vibrant, active community here. My learning path then took me a different direction as I worked on my Blues learning rather than go through the Blues path here. (Not due to any disatisfaction here) I was absent from here for many months.

When I came back the forum is a waste land. I have tried my part to do some posting. But it remains very inactive.

I'm not sure that I agree that forums are dying. FB groups may have some impact. But I am active in a few other groups, I waste a lot of time there, and am an admin on one, and see a lot of activity. The PRS guitars forum (https://forums.prsguitars.com/) probably has hundreds of posts per day. Look at te activity of My Les Paul! I realize that those are guitar model centric forums. But I am also member of a few other forums, teaching forums, thet would be considered competitive to here. So I won't mention those names. They have comparatively multiples of activity.

I fully realize and appreciate that there is limited time on the part of teachers here and, of course, limited resources that they feel they need to allocate elsewhere. And certainly, nor do I understand the business model. But I would think that membership and activity here would feed subscriptions to the lessons. If someone here was raving about a lesson I would certainly think it would encouraged some others to consider said lesson.

As it stands, with the exception of the occasional song I'm working on, I am most likely going to be absent again from here.

Hi there. We think that the forum is a pretty active place these days, and if you click on the "New Posts" tab at the top of the forum, you'll see all the new messages that are written each day. Please keep in mind that Maggior's comment was from over 2 years ago, so there's that.


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# 14
Dave-H
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Dave-H
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10/16/2019 6:31 pm

My post failed Captcha with no opportunity to re-certify. Fortunately, I composed it in a text editor.

One of the big reasons I joined GT rather than other guitar instruction sites was the promise of an active forum. As a member of a number of forums, I expected a much better platform. While I would not say that the GT forum sucks, it is absolutely not what I expected and is inferior to every other forum of which I am a member. Ben Martin excused the quality of the forum with "a very small team". How much of a team does it take to review available forum software to make sure it includes all desired features? I web searched forum software . The first site I checked... hostinger(.)com asked the question, "What Features Should the Best Forum Software Include?" They answered their own question thusly, before making any recommendations...

[br]Profile customization. Enabling users to customize their profiles can increase engagement since it makes them feel more at home and in control.

[br]A powerful text editor. Forums are almost 100% text-based, so you’ll want to offer your users a robust editor to create and customize their posts.

[br]Private messaging. Many forums are all about public discussion, but enabling private messaging is a smart way to foster interpersonal relationships.

[br]Comment signatures. Just like profile customization, this option can help you increase engagement and gives users the chance to have a little fun.

[br]Achievement systems. A lot of forums set up user ‘levels’ that can be unlocked after a certain level of activity or amount of time. It rewards users for participating in your forum frequently.

[br]A couple of missing features to add. When you select a topic, the topic should be displayed at the user's last read comment (Very annoying to have to manually jump to your last read comment), not a big deal to set a browser cookie, and should not increment the topic every time the OP checks it, skewing the number of views. Knowing that there is forum software available that meets these requirements as well as every suggestion that JJ90 made, I think it is weak tea to say, "We have a very small team", rather than admit ,"We chose the wrong package, and we don't want to correct it". Regardles of how old the original post is, many of those issues remain valid.


# 15
manXcat
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manXcat
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10/16/2019 11:06 pm
Originally Posted by: Guitar Tricks AdminPlease keep in mind that Maggior's comment was from over 2 years ago, so there's that.

Without prejudice, considering the all too apparent visible inaction on addressing any of it, anyone capable of discerning thought might reasonably think that rationalistion reason for embarrassment rather than justification?

[br]When the comments albeit understandably unwanted critique are from long term and/or annual roll over committed full access subs who are in general vociferous supporters of GT, e.g. john of MT, myself et al, one might reasonably think GT management might actually be motivated to invest in more than a tokenistic deflective response?


# 16
matonanjin2
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matonanjin2
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10/17/2019 2:26 pm
Originally Posted by: Guitar Tricks Admin

We think that the forum these dayis a pretty active place these days, and if you click on the "New Posts" tab at the top of the forum, you'll see all the new messages that are written each day. Please keep in mind that Maggior's comment was from over 2 years ago, so there's that.

While I disagree that this is "a pretty active place these days", I remain embarrassed about commenting on a message that was over two years old. But I responded to his message after I "click on the "New Posts" tab at the top of the forum, you'll see all the new messages that are written each day." So there's that.

Please feel free to delete my post.


[u]Guitars:[/u] 2014 PRS Santana, 2013 PRS Paul's, 2009 PRS Hollowbody, 1972 Gibson ES-325, 2012 Fender Strat American Standard, 2012 Yamaha Pacifica, Martin M-36, Martin 000-15M, Seagull S6 Classic[br][u]Amps:[/u] Fender Blues Junior III, Boss Eband JS-10, Line 6 POD 500X, Quilter Microblock 45

# 17
manXcat
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manXcat
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10/17/2019 11:51 pm

It's deflection matonanjin2, but I'm sure you realised that already.

Mea Culpa. I'm responsible for this thread resurfacing to top of the New Posts, and to be entirely accurate, the immediately preceding post to mine by john of MT was actually made just 18 months ago.

I could have started an entirely new thread, but adhering to courtesy of general internet forum conventions such as conducting a search before asking a quesiton to see if the question has been asked and answered before, why when this one is still salient to the specific topic I intended to comment on would or should one?

After all these are Discussion Forums for Guitar Tricks members aren't they?

Hence, my precursory "this (thread) needs bumping" accompanied by relevant commentary totally on thread topic but not in reply to any specific other post per se.

[br]So your comment in response was completely justified, as valid today with if anything increased credulity and relevance as it would have had "over 2 years ago".

To be brutally honest, when I came aong in 2018, forum activity arguably was only slightly more active than the dodo and tyrannosaurus rex are today.

Since that time I've personally been pro-active in promoting member participation leading by example. Overall activity has increased, slowly, but neither volume nor content are currently what anyone familiar with truly active forums might reasonably consider comparatively "pretty active" for any non-SIG forum, especially a commercial site forum given the significant paying customer base Guitar Tricks must entertain.


# 18

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