Another Debate

Originally posted by Axl_Rose
WOW!! wow wow wow WOW!!
Dont even think about saying guns n roses are a pop band or have pop sensibilities!! If pop song goes verse/ chorus/ verse ... then explain songs like Estranged, Locomotive or even November Rain and try and pick out a common structrue. The song estranged is unbelievable!!
Its a shame Guns n Roses became so utterly popular that people branded them pop. Its the same old story with some people, if a band peoples too popular they feel their identity is lost!
Guns n Roses - over 100 million albums in a career that spanned a couple o years!! They Released two double albums on the same day that went No.1 and No.2 in the UK and USA simultaneaously!! BEAT THAT!!

Well you just confirmed my point with the last paragraph, but on the point of pop sensibilities...Listen to Appetite For Destruction, youve got Welcome To The Jungle, Paradise City, Nightrain, Its So Easy and Sweet Child O Mine, and with the exception of Its So Easy theyre all straightforward rock/pop song, amazing choruses etc. then aswell as that you have Patience, Dont Cry great pop songs. November Rain=, Estranged, Locomotive are more epic all htough November Rain was top 10 in the US.

Pop means popular. Guns are a popular ROCK band, theres a massive difference. Dont Cry and Patience are hardly pop songs, they arent written or aimed to a different audiences than the other GnR songs.
And whats all this crap about "amazing choruses", what, songs with catchy lyrics are pop songs? It really annoys me that Guns are like the only band i like who have never comprimised their style and approach to writing for the sake of a quick hit or a radio friendly song.
The mere fact they decided on a 2 double albums (Illusions) rather than making one LP, which would have been regarded as an all time great a record, shows they didnt sell out and go for a sure hit.

That´s true man. However Don´t Cry is a little bit of fast made up song for radio. It´s an amazing song though. Guns didn´t defintly sell out. I can understand some people who say so ´cause there´s a BIG difference between Detruction and I & II albums.

But for me I & II are amazing. The agressive opening through Right Next Door To Hell, the amazing done verision of Live And Let Die, Don´t Cry, masterpiece November Rain, to speeded Garden Of Eden, very nice Dead Horse and a masterpiece again Coma.

II, One of Guns best lyrics Civil War, Izzy´s vocal on 14 Years, relaxing Yesterdays, and my three absolute fav. Guns N´ Roses songs: Locomotive, Estranged and You Could Be Mine and GN´R worst song My World.

But if they were forced to release just one album, my list would look like this:

1. Right Next Door To Hell
2. Live And Let Die
3. Don´t Cry
4. Bad Obsession
5. November Rain
6. Dead Horse
7. Coma
8. Civil War
9. Yesterdays
10. Get In The Ring
11. Locomotive
12. Estranged
13. Breakdown
14. You Could Be Mine

Not a bad record. About 7 mega hit songs at least.

i'm sorry, i would have to add sweet child of mine, i do really like Slash's playing in that

Originally posted by Axl_Rose
And whats all this crap about "amazing choruses", what, songs with catchy lyrics are pop songs? It really annoys me that Guns are like the only band i like who have never comprimised their style and approach to writing for the sake of a quick hit or a radio friendly song.
The mere fact they decided on a 2 double albums (Illusions) rather than making one LP, which would have been regarded as an all time great a record, shows they didnt sell out and go for a sure hit.

Exsqueze me? They shortened Sweet Child O' Mine for radio, and what do ya know, it ends up at #1. The Illusions are patchy albums, both albums have great songs with filler material such as My World, Knocking On Heavens Door, Dont Cry(alt lyrics).

GnR were the biggest rock band in the world, Im not saying they sold out cos they always had the pop part to their music, Axl has said it on many occasions(youll have to take my word for that). They made radio friendly songs and had hits with videos on MTV, they were a pop band, rock bands can be pop too.

In my opinion(and now,don't we all hve those),the beatles were simply an idea whose time had come.Look at how pstring talks about how radio was,just one station or something,same things played over and over,etc.
There's no stopping an idea whose time has come.
It wasn't so much the beatles themselves,but rather the ideas propelling the beatles.
The key thing for me is the idea,not the idea's propagator.
Now,about pop,selling out and all that.
If GnR shortened Sweet child of mine for radio,then to me the problem wasn't GnR,it was radio.Coz they need space to air adverts and weather forecasts and news and all that crap.And the DJ has yelpiasis,so they need time for that as well.
Don't blame the band.Blame the media the band needed to get heard.

Err no, it was Axls idea, and he swore never to do it again afterwards.

Originally posted by kingdavid
In my opinion(and now,don't we all hve those),the beatles were simply an idea whose time had come...

You might find it interesting to review some of those opinions posted here, in a thread started by one kingdavid who wondered what all the fuss was about.

BTW, using "Beatles" as a keyword in a search here raises 147 threads. I think that says a lot about their influence on us.

EH!!!

1) Dont use the phrase "exquese me", the words 'camp' and 'git' flow through my head on hearing them!!

2) Axl never wanted sweet child cut, he was enraged by it! thats why he insisted it was rereleased in full on other copies!!

ok, bit camp maybe but hilarious

Originally posted by Lordathestrings

Originally posted by kingdavid
In my opinion(and now,don't we all hve those),the beatles were simply an idea whose time had come...

You might find it interesting to review some of those opinions posted here, in a thread started by one kingdavid who wondered what all the fuss was about.

BTW, using "Beatles" as a keyword in a search here raises 147 threads. I think that says a lot about their influence on us.

The present world 100m record is about 9.78s.
Who is the most widely known and talked about sprinter?Over the years?
Probably Carl Lewis.
Or maybe Maurice Green.
But the 9.78 belongs to some guy whose name even I don't remember.
Of course music and sprinting aren't the same thing.But I think the scenario here is abit like it is/was with the beatles.
And Lord,don't look to what typeing in this search brings up.I typed in the word beatles.And it's bringing up threads that have nothing to do with the beatles,and the beatles aren't even mentioned anywhere in the thread(even the signatures :)).

ADDETUM
When this 9.78 record was set,the guy was said to be the first one to legally run that fast(some other dude had clocked 9.78 before,but I think he was either later found to have doped or there was a very big wind pushing or something,so much so that his record was nullified),and as a consequence,was declared the fastest man ever.
Fastest man ever?
Michael Johnson's record over 200m is 19.32s.Quick maths will tell you that 19.32s over 200 metres is the same as 9.66s(:eek: ) over 100 metres.
Talk is cheap.
Fastest man ever.
Most influential band ever.
Sounds so similar to me.

[Edited by kingdavid on 01-30-2003 at 01:53 AM]

I have a cat called sparky, therefore guns n roses are the most influencial band even,
sounds similar to me like.

Human beings are made to learn from others.You learn to speak mostly from your mom and immediate family.You learn to play all sorts of games and stuff from the kids next door and in school.You learn about sex from maybe some kids next door,or maybe from school,or maybe your elder siblings,or if you're lucky,mom and/or dad.
We will always be influenced by whatever is around us.Good or bad or in between.Not necessarily because the influeces are great or whatever,but simply because that's the way the human way of learning is structured.
We all know Bill Gates.Most of us also know Henry Ford(Not personally,d'uh!).Now,Henry Ford was quite an influence on Bill Gates,by his own admission,so much so that he(BIll) kept his(Henry's) poster in his office(or home,can't quite remember).You see,Henry Ford may not have invented the automobile,but by virtue of what he did,he invented the auto industry.Bill Gates may not have invented the pc,but he certainly invented the software industry,starting a pure software play at a time when computer manufacturers considered software a distraction that helped sell the hardware,which is where the money was at.Quite revolutionary,these two,if you ask me.
Now,to argue that Bill Gates wouldn't have happened if it wasn't for Henry Ford(or Thomas Watson Jr.,IBM's most influential CEO of all time) is a quite similar to argue that GnR,Aerosmith,and pretty much everyone else after the B's wouldn't have existed if it wasn't for the B's.
I mean no offence,but I find those arguments so....groupie.

I think Kingdavids right, but I still dont like the Beatles. :)

Without Beatles, music wouldn't be what it has been. Thats all there is to say about it.

Without cars music wouldnt be the same...

If the sky was pink music wouldnt be the same...

If dogs could talk music wouldnt be the same...

If Axl weren't such a putz, he might still be making good music!

I can believe that.