I've heard wintersun and they just didn't do it much for me. I like black metal dont' get me wrong, love it. But I'm easily more into death metal. I can count the death metal bands I don't like on one hand. And regarding Jolly, that's part of what makes black metal black metal. Some do sing occasionally but it's mostly shrieks. Older black metal bands like Venom don't really have quite the shriek that newer ones have.