It doesn't take talent to follow a long established formula, make slight alterations and churn out cheap records that thousands and thousands of people will gobble up. Business sense, a little foresight, yes, but neither business sense nor foresight really count as "musical talent" in my book.

Marketing((Group of attractive, well manicured young men + dance routines) + ("poppy" music - anything original + pocket beats)) = A lot of teen girls and top 40 radio time

Marketing(foul language+moderately heavy music+gimmick-originality) = Angsty teen boys and angry men with no necks who want to mosh

So True.

Marketing is not good for the music industry. Since marketing is based on the fact that you are making products to fit into what people want. Well, it was ok with one band, but now no one has broken the mold. They keep marketing the same type of nu-metal crap.

I believe that Slipknot has talented musicians, heck, I like Stone Sour. Corey Taylor is an awesome singer, and Mick can shred. But when you try to sound like crap, as Rask said, it's insulting.

Talent is in the eye of the beholder...

that said, I hate Slipknot, and almost as much as I hate them, I enjoy laughing at/making fun of their diehard fans... I've heard some of the guitarist's solo album and it is pretty good, not ground breaking, but good... which makes me wonder why it is that he/they sound so uninspired and whatever in their most successful pursuit.

Slipknot sells records because their music is simple, loud and fast; their fans, most of whom seem to be middle to upper class 12-16 year old males who are overweight or underweight, have a list of self-diagnosed mental and emotional issues that go out the door and down the block, like to act like they hate everything but really think life is kinda cool, and can't get dates, seem to enjoy popping in CD's and just going "check it out: DUHNUNUNUNUNUNUNUNUUUUUUUUH!!!!!" and headbanging along to the music, while their friends go "that's fukking awesome" and they talk about how they all know karate, know all about guns, have scored 55 times when in fact they've never kissed a girl before, etc.

It's beginner metal. It's like you know how they say marijuana is the starter drug? Slipknot and bands like them are starter metal bands. They aren't really all that metally, they aren't really all that amazingly talented, but they do the job, kinda, and make it so you can later appreciate bands like Refused. The four, skinny, knit-sweater-wearing Swedish vegans of Refused would make Slipknot and its fans cry for things to be turned down a little.

But then I like Jamiroquai and Daft Punk... so what do I know...?

Dude this 'Refused' band seems interesting...do you know where i can hear some of their stuff??? i have alot of friends who absolutely love slipknot so i've found that some of there more "melodic" songs such as 'Me Inside' can be kind of entertaining....but tell me more about this 'Refused' i think i am ery open-minded and will listen to anything that seems to be decent music to decide if it really is or not...

check out arch enemy..there guitarist are really really good..sorta like melodic metal somewat.ther from sweden

Refused is a Swedish hardcore-punk-metal band that released CD's from the early 90's; their last CD was recorded in 98 or 99, and released in 99 or 00 (i'm not positive which).

If you want to hear an example of Refused at their angriest, loudest, and most melodic, check out the songs New Noise and Worms of the Senses/Faculties Of The Skull. They will tear your face off.

Other great songs include Sunflower Princess (this song reminds me of a girlfriend of mine who died; first of all, she loved sunflowers, had sunflower jewelry, shirts, etc. When I found out she died in a shooting, I told the friend who told me to shut up, and never listened to anything anyone said about it. I've also never cried over it. in the outro, the lead singer wails "i won't listen, i won't cry, sunflower princess" in a furitive, desperate tone), Burn It, Pretty Face, Protest Song '68, and Liberation Fequency. Damn, anything they do is good.

There's another song called Tannhauser/Derive (sp?) which uses violin, upright bass and viola with electric guitar and hardcore drums, to create a really beautiful, deadly sound. It makes me feel like a murder in winter...

koooooooool