My first multitrack

[Kevin Taylor]

I'm opening myself up to major critisism here, but this is my first song I've attemted on Cubase VST. Basically, it's a song about a guy going home from the war and his mental thoughts and journey along the way.
(also subtle references to the 9/11 event)

I did all the instruments myself & there's
still some work to do on the vocals etc... but wanted to get a few first impressions before I continue.
(like does it need harmonies on the last coupla verses??)

The main song is at:
http://members.rogers.com/schmange6/GoinHome.Inst17.mp3

... and there's a log of the recording process at:
http://www.itsmynewsletter.com/cgi-bin/itsmy/go.exe?page=48&domain=23&webdir=schmange

Any comments (good or bad) definitely welcome....
I'm about to start work on my next one so any help would be greatly appreciated.
TIA

[trendkillah]

Damn nice one man!

Only comment I have is that there is a lot of sibilance going on on the vocals. I'd put a de-esser on it, or just attenuate the 7-10kHz region a bit.

Nice work!

[Lordathestrings]

It so nice to hear something substantial once in a while!

[^Chacron^]

Schmange, is there any way you can send me the mp3? Every time I try to get it off that site my media player only gives me a few seconds at a time before buffering it for what feels like half an hour......I like what I've heard so far, and whilst i'm talkin to you thanks for the scales you've put on this site......very useful :)

[Kevin Taylor]

sure no problem. just send me your email address & I'll mail it to ya. :)

schmange@guitartricks.com

[Bardsley]

Schmange, I'd love to hear it too, if you wouldn't mind mailing it to me, and leave off the .mp3 at the end so that it gets to me. This is the only way I can get .mp3s of the net, because the college server blocks them. If it's too much of a hassle, don't worry about it, but I'd like to hear it. Now that I'm at college I rarely get to listen to people's mp3s from the net.

[Kevin Taylor]

yup..no problem. :)
I need you guys to send me your email addresses tho, so I can add the file as an attachment. I can't get your address from guitartricks cause your profile button just gives me an email form. (unless I'm missing something)

I'm confudled how come you guys can't download it directly tho.... I thought all ya had to do was option-click (or right click on a pc), which brings up a dialogue box to download it. From there you could name the file anything you wanted. It's a pretty large file btw (9.5 MB) ...so if you're on dialup it's gonna take forever.

Anyhoo... if you're still having problems, lemme know & I'll try to help.

[Christoph]

Wasn't this in the 'song writing' forum too?

[^Chacron^]

Okay I've made my email available now, thanx.

[Bardsley]

Actually, it seems to be working. It used to be the case (the College netwrok security stuff has changed recently) that, even though the file was saved as something else, the site it was coming form still has the .mp3 in it, so it wouldn't work and istead I would end up with a downloaded file saying that I was supposed to be using the network for "educational purposes". I doubt that they have made that document 9.5 meg though...
Heh, maybe this means I can go and listen to other stuff too....
I think it is perfectly "educational", lol. ;)

[Kevin Taylor]

> Okay I've made my email available now, thanx.

Where is it tho? I still can't find it in your profile .... all that comes up is a form letter that forwards messages to you...unless I'm totally clueless and just looking in the wrong place.

Best thing is just write me directly schmange@guitartricks.com
with your address. Put 'schmange' in the subject line and Outlook will flag me with nifty colours and stuff :)

>>Wasn't this in the 'song writing' forum too?

yup. I'm delving into something I haven't spent too much time on previously, like song structure and lyric writing.
I've read up on books like 'how to write a hit song' etc...
but most of em stick to the old tired formula of verse-chorus-verse-chorus-bridge-chorus-end 3:30
I wanna do something a little different so I was interested in hearing opinions on the structure of this particular song.
It's almost 7 minutes long so some replies I"m getting are telling me the song loses their interest coming up on the last chorus. Then when the lead kicks in their ears prick up again... trouble is, the song is part of a concept involving an albums worth of material, and the fade out on the lead is leading directly into the next song so it's necessary the way it is.
I'm thinking now that I need to add powerful harmonies on the last couple of verses... cause in a sense it's a story of a guy going home after all his friends have been killed and the outrage he feels that not only has he lost friends, but war still continues regardless of how many lives it costs. (ie, the sound effects in the middle with all the guns and stuff, is Hannoi Hanna talking propoganda to the American troops about the American government sending teenagers to die for nothing more than profit.
Maybe I need another voice over where the drum corps part comes in... blah.... never mind. I'm just rambling.

I guess what I need is an intelligent discussion with some people about putting real substance into songs and intentionally writing hidden meanings that require several listens before you understand what the songwriter meant to say.

[Christoph]

Originally posted by schmange
I've read up on books like 'how to write a hit song' etc...but most of em stick to the old tired formula of verse-chorus-verse-chorus-bridge-chorus-end...

Yup, 90 percent of the so-called "popular" songs out there follow that format. Most people aren't so deep into music that they want to be surprised or hear anything different. They just want some little thing that repeats, so they can sing along with it in the car on the way to work.



Originally posted by schmange
I guess what I need is an intelligent discussion with some people about putting real substance into songs and intentionally writing hidden meanings that require several listens before you understand what the songwriter meant to say.

That's what I like about Pink Floyd. Their songs are so laden with meaning that to understand them you really have to know a lot about 20th century England and the lives of the songwriters.


By the way, if you want some interesting songwriting check out Tool. They have recently become one of my favorite bands. Their songs have a definite chorus, but beyond that, they're just all over the place.

[Benoit]

I wanted to write an hommage to canadian troups from some of the things my uncle told us about WW2.

Never had the talent to write the whole thing.

I'll be sure to listen to your song, but on dial, it may be very long :)

[Bardsley]

One thing I found was that the voice was a little too washed in reverb for me. I understood the effect you were going for, but I think that in generaly you tended to overdo the effects a little. Very Leonard Cohen in a way though. I need to listen to it a bit more for something a bit more useful.

[^Chacron^]

Yeah, Pink Floyd are masterful with lyrics.....as you've brought it up here's some food for thought....

On the animals album I'm convinced that the 'Pigs (3 different ones) are metaphorical descriptions of people.....possibly politicians as the second one describes Margret Thatcher perfectly, and they have a dig at her in 'The Fletcher Memorial Home' as well. Any thoughts on that?

And Tool certainly have a talent for the black and disturbing.....their Schism video is really freaky and adds to the effect of the song perfectly. The video for Parabola has been banned in england in its uncut form......must definitely be worth a look.

[Kevin Taylor]

Another amazing album for lyrics and 'hidden meaning' stuff is Supertramp - Crime of the Century. I've spent years listening to that album trying to figure out all the little secrets. (like, I'm sure the kids at the beginning are subliminally shouting stuff like 'turn it up louder next time' and 'I love Supertramp')

[Christoph]

Originally posted by ^Chacron^
And Tool . . . their Schism video is really freaky and adds to the effect of the song perfectly.

I love that video!!! The first time I saw it, I was like, "What the f---?" It's the first truly original video in 'mainstream' rock in a decade or so. Most videos these days are basically just nonsensical camera shots and angles interspersed with shots of the band bopping up and down. It gets old after a while.

I haven't seen the Parabola video yet . . . but I'll be sure to check it out. What's the general gist of it?

As for Pink Floyd, I don't have the Animals disk. I was referring mainly to the Wall, Dark Side of the Moon, and Wish You Were Here. The symbolism of the pigs would definitely make sense though.

[^Chacron^]

Dude, get the animals.....they rock!

Havent seen parabola yet coz kerrang can only show it late....i'll stay up one night when I dont have to work next morning and see what its like :)

[Benoit]

Took me a long time to download that file, the joy of dial-up :)

Personnaly I think you really got a great song, love the feeling of it.

The only thing I could say is that the voice kinds a get irratating sometimes. Maybe too much reverb.

A part from this, it's really good. I love the solo. It's nice to see that even if you can shred like hell, you still follow the feel of the song and don't loose it by trying to impress the audience with your speed. It does complete the song nicely.

You have a well balanced song, I like it. I'll be waiting for the next...