Speed picking help

[Slasha]

it seems that i have had trouble with my picking hand. My left hand can go fast enough, but it seems my right hand always drags in tempo. I cant seem to get it past about 16th notes at 146. I pratice chromatic exercises, legato, and i've tried some picking exercises. If anyone could give me an exercise or something that worked particularly well for them, or that they like it would be greatly appreciated!

:cool: Slasha

[James]

I think the best way to improve right hand picking speed is through tremolo excercises, because when you think about it, if you can't play the same note at a certain tempo, how would you be able to play a scale at the same tempo? What I do when I want to take on a new speed is I first work on tremelo picking at that speed, just open strings, then notes, then moving up a scale. When it gets to the point that that speed is a breeze on my hand, I start trying scales or whatever. It comes a lot easier. Does this make sense? If not just ask I'll try and clear it up.

[Slasha]

No, it makes perfect sense, thank you.

P.S. At what tempo would you consider pretty fast? (16th notes)

Thanks for your help!

:cool: Slasha

[Bodomchild]

146 bpm is pretty impressive-keep it up! Just keep in mind the two fundamentals:consistency and distance = time- but you knew that.

[James]

speed is all relative. A few months ago I thought 165bpm (16th notes) was really fast because I couldn't do it. But I trained and now it I have it. Now what's fast to me would be more like 200. Whereas someone just starting out might think 165 is insane.

It's all relative.

[FretSlug]

Tempo 146 is quite fast, and if I remember right you were like 14 or so so keep it up!!

I myself think now that tempo 208-216 is hard but I can manage to play 16:ths at that tempo (chromatic) but hey, I'm 2 years older than you and when I was in your age I bet I couldn't have managed even with the tempo 120. :)

I bet that when you are as old as I am now you will play something like 250.. Have fun practising, btw, you got Petrucci's Rock Discipline, the chromatic exercises are great training for speed and such..

[kingdavid]

I'm not all that fast or experienced,but I can tell you this:
Don't think about what you're doing.Just do it.(like that's a whole lot of help:))
When I was learning picking simple melody lines,and it was such that I needed to strike a bass line at virtually the same instant that I made the chord change,pausing and "concentrating" made my picking hand get left behind.But funny enough,when I stopped trying too much,it worked.
It'a a bit like a mobile phone game:you'll never set a new record when you're actuallt trying;it happens when you're not even thinking about it,just playing the game.
Try to relax.

[Soul_V]

Hi!!! I play the Example 9 of john petrucci's Rock discipline of the technique (speed and accuracy) section transposing the 5th fret to the 12th one. I play this at 300bpm and between each beat I play 4 notes.

I wanna know if this is fast, and in what level (bpm) do u think is quite fast.

Thank u!!!!!!! :) :D

[Jolly McJollyson]

Hi!!! I play the Example 9 of john petrucci's Rock discipline of the technique (speed and accuracy) section transposing the 5th fret to the 12th one. I play this at 300bpm and between each beat I play 4 notes.

I wanna know if this is fast, and in what level (bpm) do u think is quite fast.

Thank u!!!!!!! :) :D
I think you may be miscounting...because if that's true, you're playing 20 notes per second.

[silentmusic]

Hi!!! I play the Example 9 of john petrucci's Rock discipline of the technique (speed and accuracy) section transposing the 5th fret to the 12th one. I play this at 300bpm and between each beat I play 4 notes.

I wanna know if this is fast, and in what level (bpm) do u think is quite fast.

Thank u!!!!!!! :) :D

I dont think so!! (but in saying that if u have a recording of u playing at 300bpm then i will admit im wrong but i gotta hear it first) I have that dvd and even John breaks down at something just over 200bpm :eek: and 200bpm is fast even for John.. and remember ur technique must be clean at ur higest speed.. 16th notes at 300bpm could probably open up a wormhole and suck u in....!!

[CW14]

Hi!!! I play the Example 9 of john petrucci's Rock discipline of the technique (speed and accuracy) section transposing the 5th fret to the 12th one. I play this at 300bpm and between each beat I play 4 notes.

I wanna know if this is fast, and in what level (bpm) do u think is quite fast.

Thank u!!!!!!! :) :D
Is it clean? If so, that is rather fast indeed :eek:

[Soul_V]

yeah, i think its clean, all the notes can be heard clearly, i can't record it by the moment, because the software i use to record sounds with a lot of hiss, and that makes it dirty, anyway, if i can record it, take it for sure that you will get the copy!!!

thanks!!!!!!!!!


Parallel Souls rules!!!!!!!!!!!

[Soul_V]

yeah, its clean, all the notes can be heard clearly, i can't record it by the moment, because the software i use to record sounds with a lot of hiss, and that makes it dirty, anyway, if i can record it, take it for sure that you will get the copy!!!

thanks!!!!!!!!!


Parallel Souls rules!!!!!!!!!!!

[silentmusic]

yeah, its clean, all the notes can be heard clearly, i can't record it by the moment, because the software i use to record sounds with a lot of hiss, and that makes it dirty, anyway, if i can record it, take it for sure that you will get the copy!!!

thanks!!!!!!!!!


Parallel Souls rules!!!!!!!!!!!
u sure that ur playing 16th notes ( 4 notes between each click) at 300bpm?

[Jolly McJollyson]

u sure that ur playing 16th notes ( 4 notes between each click) at 300bpm?
no way. I just listened to what that would sound like on power tab...I think we're having a miscommunication.

[Soul_V]

yeah man its for sure!!!!! example 9 rock discipline transpoising the 5th fret to the 12th one. At 300 bpm, it takes a lot of effort to reach it, but finally i make it!!!!

[silentmusic]

yeah man its for sure!!!!! example 9 rock discipline transpoising the 5th fret to the 12th one. At 300 bpm, it takes a lot of effort to reach it, but finally i make it!!!!
I still gotta hear it.. its all well and good saying it.. i could say i can jump over the moon but it aint happenin... how long u playing ?

[Soul_V]

I still gotta hear it.. its all well and good saying it.. i could say i can jump over the moon but it aint happenin... how long u playing ?

I´ve been playing the guitar for about 6 years and i have played that exercise for about 4 months, til that day i get an adiction to the hyper speed.

[Jolly McJollyson]

Petrucci never plays anything in exercise 9 over 200 bpm...no offense man, but I have a hard time believing you're playing 16th notes at 300 bpm.

[Jolly McJollyson]

I heard what you sent me, so yeah, there's no miscommunication, but I still have a hard time believing you can play it that fast. Just throw a recording onto the internet so I can hear it. If you can, I will be absolutely stunned and amazed.

[silentmusic]

If u can get a copy to me it would be cool :cool: I have guitar port and can slow tracks down.. I could listen and count between clicks and see if u are doing 16th notes at 300 bpm!!

[Superhuman]

Sorry man but that's not possible. Michael Angelo doesnt even play that fast, the only guitarists anywhere near that speed are Rusty Cooley or Francesco Farerri and they certainly don't hit 300 for 16ths, more like 265bpm. Recalculate those notes or post and video and contact the Guinness Book Of Records!

[Soul_V]

actually, i even play it over the guitar pro playing that thing... im not trying to impress you, but i believe in my speed and my technique, and anyway, there are persons who have saw me play this thing, and maybe you can think is impossible playing that, but let me tell you that i can play it between 200 and 240 with no problem, and i bet u can´t even get the 190....


You make me doubt for a moment, but yesterday i saw petrucci's DVD, and its exactly the same way i play it....

[silentmusic]

actually, i even play it over the guitar pro playing that thing... im not trying to impress you, but i believe in my speed and my technique, and anyway, there are persons who have saw me play this thing, and maybe you can think is impossible playing that, but let me tell you that i can play it between 200 and 240 with no problem, and i bet u can´t even get the 190....


You make me doubt for a moment, but yesterday i saw petrucci's DVD, and its exactly the same way i play it....

yesterday u said u can play it at 300 now today u can play between 200 and 240? and if u can play it then its cool.. its not a question of if im impressed or anyone else for that matter.. its a question of I dont believe anyone can play 300bpm 16th notes so its nothing personal.. and now u are doubting my or other people who replyd to u saying that u can do this speed? I know how fast I can play I dont need to post it up for u or anyone else for that matter its not a competition.. my proof is in my music which is what its all about.. :D

[Soul_V]

yesterday u said u can play it at 300 now today u can play between 200 and 240? and if u can play it then its cool.. its not a question of if im impressed or anyone else for that matter.. its a question of i dont believe anyone can play 300bpm 16th notes so its nothing personal..

it wasnt a message for you man, sorry anyway... but what i mean is that i can play it between 200 and 240 without any problem and i bet superhuman that he can´t play it at 190

[silentmusic]

it wasnt a message for you man, sorry anyway... but what i mean is that i can play it between 200 and 240 without any problem and i bet superhuman that he can´t play it at 190
If u can play that speed thats very cool im not doubting that at all :) actualy superhuman can u should hear that guy he is wicked.. :D

[CW14]

actually, i even play it over the guitar pro playing that thing... im not trying to impress you, but i believe in my speed and my technique, and anyway, there are persons who have saw me play this thing, and maybe you can think is impossible playing that, but let me tell you that i can play it between 200 and 240 with no problem, and i bet u can´t even get the 190....


You make me doubt for a moment, but yesterday i saw petrucci's DVD, and its exactly the same way i play it....
Theres no need to challenge Superhuman's ability.

I actually believe you. I don't think theres anything really amazing about playing extremely fast. 300bpm is possible, all it takes is a LOT of practice.

[Superhuman]

Just out of interest I tried a little experiment and set up Cubase with the metronome at 300 bpm and recorded the following exercise pattern (it's not musical but helps to count notes per meter):

Fingering:1234
Root Fret:12
-----------------------------------------------------------1234321
-----------------------1234321------------------------1234-------etc.
----1234321-------1234-------4321----------------1234
1234-------4321234---------------4321--------1234
---------------------------------------4321234

The fastest I could get with accuracy is 12 notes per beat, bearing in mind that the above is a basic exercise and not a complicated run or full scale. It may well be possible to hit 16ths on this particular pattern but I can't see it being possible in regular playing. My point being, it's easy when you are using the same shape up and down but when you start throwing in different patterns on diagonal sweeps of the fretboard (required with four note per string progressions) it becomes impossible. The right hand can only strum so fast and the left hand will find difficulty with changing finger shapes.

[silentmusic]

Just out of interest I tried a little experiment and set up Cubase with the metronome at 300 bpm and recorded the following exercise pattern (it's not musical but helps to count notes per meter):

Fingering:1234
Root Fret:12
-----------------------------------------------------------1234321
-----------------------1234321------------------------1234-------etc.
----1234321-------1234-------4321----------------1234
1234-------4321234---------------4321--------1234
---------------------------------------4321234

The fastest I could get with accuracy is 12 notes per beat, bearing in mind that the above is a basic exercise and not a complicated run or full scale. It may well be possible to hit 16ths on this particular pattern but I can't see it being possible in regular playing. My point being, it's easy when you are using the same shape up and down but when you start throwing in different patterns on diagonal sweeps of the fretboard (required with four note per string progressions) it becomes impossible. The right hand can only strum so fast and the left hand will find difficulty with changing finger shapes.
Exactly!! :cool:

[CW14]

Just out of interest I tried a little experiment and set up Cubase with the metronome at 300 bpm and recorded the following exercise pattern (it's not musical but helps to count notes per meter):

Fingering:1234
Root Fret:12
-----------------------------------------------------------1234321
-----------------------1234321------------------------1234-------etc.
----1234321-------1234-------4321----------------1234
1234-------4321234---------------4321--------1234
---------------------------------------4321234

The fastest I could get with accuracy is 12 notes per beat, bearing in mind that the above is a basic exercise and not a complicated run or full scale. It may well be possible to hit 16ths on this particular pattern but I can't see it being possible in regular playing. My point being, it's easy when you are using the same shape up and down but when you start throwing in different patterns on diagonal sweeps of the fretboard (required with four note per string progressions) it becomes impossible. The right hand can only strum so fast and the left hand will find difficulty with changing finger shapes.
By 12 notes per beat, did you mean 12 notes per second or was the 1 in front of the 2 a typo?

At 300bpm, 12 notes per click IS impossible

[Leedogg]

We got ourselves a throwdown brewin' here!

[silentmusic]

We got ourselves a throwdown brewin' here!
count me in :p na joking aside its not a competition I still think its a missundertsanding :rolleyes:

[Superhuman]

Problem solved! At 300 bpm at 4/4 time, the inflection is on the first beat of each bar of 4 shorter clicks. The true speed is therefor not 12 notes per beat, that IS impossible, it is 12 notes per second. I just set the motronome to 60 bpm and played the same run a few times. I actually got it to 16 for one full bar after a minute or so. That explains everything, its just the maths of it, there is no way anyone can play 16 notes between each blip on 300. Try it again set at 60 and just count the number of notes between each beat, that's the most simple way. I did a little reading and discovered that Michale Angelo has achieved 22 nps, now that's impressive!

Still though it's an interesting way of increasing speed.

[Superhuman]

Also, at 300 bpm at 4/4 time, this is divisible by 60 (4 x 60 secs), easy to make a mistake.

BTW I just read about this chump who claims to play 80 nps and while melting his pectrum... now that's a joke!

[silentmusic]

Also, at 300 bpm at 4/4 time, this is divisible by 60 (4 x 60 secs), easy to make a mistake.

BTW I just read about this chump who claims to play 80 nps and while melting his pectrum... now that's a joke!
80nps? damn thats so slow lol :rolleyes:

[Akira]

BTW I just read about this chump who claims to play 80 nps and while melting his pectrum... now that's a joke!

That guy also has an ego the size of... I don't know... something so large that the human brain can simply not even begin to comprehend something of its size.

[CW14]

Problem solved! At 300 bpm at 4/4 time, the inflection is on the first beat of each bar of 4 shorter clicks. The true speed is therefor not 12 notes per beat, that IS impossible, it is 12 notes per second. I just set the motronome to 60 bpm and played the same run a few times. I actually got it to 16 for one full bar after a minute or so. That explains everything, its just the maths of it, there is no way anyone can play 16 notes between each blip on 300. Try it again set at 60 and just count the number of notes between each beat, that's the most simple way. I did a little reading and discovered that Michale Angelo has achieved 22 nps, now that's impressive!

Still though it's an interesting way of increasing speed.
Soul_V claimed to be playing at 300bpm with 16th notes (4 notes per click), not 16 notes per click

And yeah that guy who claimed to have played at 80nps is both full of &^%* and is quite far up his own ass.

[Soul_V]

Soul_V claimed to be playing at 300bpm with 16th notes (4 notes per click), not 16 notes per click

And yeah that guy who claimed to have played at 80nps is both full of &^%* and is quite far up his own ass.
but also playing 16th beats in 300 bpm is quite fast, 20 nps

but playing 80nps is impossible for a human being!!!!!

[Fretfire]

Sorry man but that's not possible. Michael Angelo doesnt even play that fast, the only guitarists anywhere near that speed are Rusty Cooley or Francesco Farerri and they certainly don't hit 300 for 16ths, more like 265bpm. Recalculate those notes or post and video and contact the Guinness Book Of Records!

I agree , 300 bpm at 4/4 time with 16th notes, which is 4 notes per click....it really depends on the songs beat, but thats approximately 20 notes per second average !!, and doing it for the rest of the song is physically IMPOSSIBLE. It requires unbelievable endurance and dexterity to maintain playing at that speed.

Even the " Speedkills " by Michael Angelo has an average tempo of 140 Bpm, Imagine playing it twice as fast without rest. Now picture that. Rusty Cooley does about 210 on his fastest solo which is "the Butcher " while Francesco Fareri does about 225 (powertab) on his fastest clip but its unclean and crappy with lots of distortion. Maybe the cleanest he can do at 180 to 220 at 16th notes full speed with tapping.

Oh by the way, that guy who claimed he can play 80 Notes per second and his plectrum melts is ANDY VAN HATCHER....It's a ridiculous joke, I wonder why some people like him blatantly make a fool out of himself, thinking he can decieve and impress other people, by creating incredible but baseless claims posted over the internet. He's just a frustrated speedfreak wannabe with an ego the human brain can simply not even begin to comprehend something of its size as Akira pointed out.

[Soul_V]

I agree , 300 bpm at 4/4 time with 16th notes, which is 4 notes per click....it really depends on the songs beat, but thats approximately 20 notes per second average !!, and doing it for the rest of the song is physically IMPOSSIBLE. It requires unbelievable endurance and dexterity to maintain playing at that speed.

Even the " Speedkills " by Michael Angelo has an average tempo of 140 Bpm, Imagine playing it twice as fast without rest. Now picture that. Rusty Cooley does about 210 on his fastest solo which is "the Butcher " while Francesco Fareri does about 225 (powertab) on his fastest clip but its unclean and crappy with lots of distortion. Maybe the cleanest he can do at 180 to 220 at 16th notes full speed with tapping.

Oh by the way, that guy who claimed he can play 80 Notes per second and his plectrum melts is ANDY VAN HATCHER....It's a ridiculous joke, I wonder why some people like him blatantly make a fool out of himself, thinking he can decieve and impress other people, by creating incredible but baseless claims posted over the internet. He's just a frustrated speedfreak wannabe with an ego the human brain can simply not even begin to comprehend something of its size as Akira pointed out.

Im agree with you man, any human being can play that!!!!