Drug Abuse In Music

[lalimacefolle]

Let me draw some background for you...
I live in the second biggest town in France, and I have been a pro musician for close to 3 years now... I haven't been gigging a lot in those 3 years, since I did all those studio sessions and teaching (private and in school).

But I missed gigging, so I decided to go back to one of the very few Pub in my town where there are jams, to maybe hook up with some guys and form a band...
And I had forgotten the kind of people you could find there. I met some guys who had had some kind of success but had split up because of the heroin addiction of their drummer and bassist... Pretty much everyone was smoking majijuana, and lots of people where too drunk to actually listen to the music (which by the way kind of sucked, because everyone was struggling only to stay on their feet)

Now this pub is in the part of the town where artists meet, and I guess pretty much everyone there had some income due to music, or painting, or dancing, or visual art... But seeing them actually destroying themselves from within just disgusted me, and I remembered it was the thing that made me stop gigging...

What do you think of all those substances? Do you think that you have to use them to be creative? Do you actually use them? Do you play better after a drink or a joint? Let's have this debate...

[templd50]

I feel a joint is ok--ONLY if you can still play> I feel pot can enhance music--mainly listening to it.
I feel drinking and playing DO NOT MIX. You cant do both and play well. Any other form of drugs is harmfull and will kill you eventually so I have no need be around anyone who dose that ****.

[James]

Good topic lal.

Well I don't there's any argument that herion and cocaine and incredibly destructive substances that will seriously mess you over in time. Look at James Taylor for one, but there have been countless others I'm sure.

Alchohal can be bad and can lead to very serious problems (footnote: see Dave Crosby). I guess that too much while playing can limit your playing ability. Take Slash for example: awesome player in my opinion, I love him. But he's notorious for going on stage drunk and as a result he plays really sloppy.

Marijuana... whatever. If you do it fine, if not fine. It depends on what you're doing with your music I think. If you're a serious musician who needs to practice seriously for four hours a day that stay away from anything that will alter your mind. But if you're more of a creative song writer then maybe you can get away with it. Look at Dylan, the Beatles (well, practically all those 60s artists- actually I'd hazard to say almost ALL artists regardless of time period).

Anything in excess is going to stifle you in the long run I think.

[Gulder]

Well, if you're a little nervous before a gig some booze can't hurt... I'm not saying you have to drink a whole bottle of some cheap ass Wiskey, but a _few_ beers can't hurt imho.
On the contrairy drugs shouldn't be used. Yes, some artist had made some well know pieces of art/music, whatever. But, lets face it, I've never seen some one on influence making a rembrandt masterpiece or a mozart concerto suite.

It's pretty sad for you Lalimacefolle, but it can't be the place was full of that kind of people ? Maybe you're looking at the wrong place ?

It's just my opinion, but then again you don't have to listen to a drunk like me :)

[Raskolnikov]

My opinion if this:
If it interferes with your playing, then you're going too far.

Drunk, stoned stupid, or drooling on yourself because you injected Heroin into your arm; you're equally useless on stage. I also think that taking something to get over nerves is a bad thing - you're creating a dependance you don't need and ultemately crippling yourself in the long run. That isn't to say I won't have a drink or maybe two before I go on and nurse a drink per set (because I do), but it's not because of nerves.

I myself try and stay away from anything I don't think I could quit at any time I wanted.

[lalimacefolle]

Originally posted by Gulder
It's pretty sad for you Lalimacefolle, but it can't be the place was full of that kind of people ? Maybe you're looking at the wrong place ?

Well, I guess it's trendy in my town to be an addict and a musician :D

[trendkillah]

I think drugs are for losers. If you need it to be creative, it's even more sad.

Personally the 'high' I get from playing live is sufficient to enjoy it.

[i.s.marshall]

my old man was a drunk my freinds were junkies, and none of them were nice people when high, if you cant get high on life forget it, and i dont mean dont drink or smoke but every time i get together with the guitar playing fraternity, becouse of booze or drugs not one of them ever finishes or gets close to finishing a song, ten or so guys sitting around all playing different riffs, so for me drugs booze and music dont mix.

[lalimacefolle]

That's my point I.s., I think that taking drugs is a very selfish move, and since music is there to communicate, it seems to me they are totally in opposition...

[Lordathestrings]

It was long enough ago that I can talk rationally about it now. Over a period of a few years, I tried just about everything but heroin, and since then I've stopped using anything but alcohol. Even that is way down from my 20's. And I haven't had a cigarette in years.

I never could play worth a damn while I was stoned. All it was good for was parking myself on my butt and listening to someone else's music! Having artistic inclinations makes musicians particularly 'at risk' of addiction to drugs that seem to enhance the effects of music. That's sad, because it will definitely destroy your creativity, and trash out the rest of your life while its at it.

Contrary to an aquaintance's assumption, when I visit my old hometown, I don't hang out with the old friends I used to party with. Most of 'em pretty much stopped growing, in any sense of the term, about 30 years ago. Quite a few of them are dead.

I read David Crosby's autobiography a while ago. He nearly died from free-basing cocaine. That's why he had to have a liver transplant. The one comment he made that stuck with me went something like this...

"Our parents, and various authority figures, all lied to us about so many things, including the effects of marijuana. But they were right about one thing. It does lead to other, more dangerous drugs."

There used to be a saying among dealers... "The first one's free... The rest you pay for." 'Not true: you pay for all of them, one way or another!

[Raskolnikov]

Laying in that plastic bed thinking how things were so cool to me
My baby likes to shoot pool
I like laying naked in my bedroom
tieing off that dinosaur tonight
Used to be so cool

But now I've got that needle
and I can't change
But I can't breathe
Take it away and I want more and more

One day I'm going to lose the war...

Pool Shark - Bradley Noel

[Edited by Raskolnikov on 03-04-2002 at 09:51 PM]

[Incidents Happen]

yea shootin up is crazy

[pstring]

Drugs and Music, the undertakers best moneymaker, let's take a moment to reflect on all the positive things drugs have done for music, well that didn't take long did it. All the wasted lives over the years, but still the sex, drugs and rock&roll image is glamorized, will we ever learn?

[Lordathestrings]

Originally posted by pstring
...but still the sex, drugs and rock&roll image is glamorized, will we ever learn? Rock'n'Roll has always been about sex (that's the original meaning of the phrase!), and about young people rebelling against their parents by doing things that piss 'em off. You just can't piss 'em off any worse than by turning into a druggie!

[pstring]

Yeah, I know, I've been down that dead end road too, to my own shame!

[zeb985]

This is a really interesting debate..... From my own personal knowledge drugs are a waste of time. whoevers on them more and likely is just losing money , time and people they care about. The hard part with drugs isnt starting or being on them its when people quit using is when it gets hard. haveing to open your eyes for the first time and realize the only way to quit is to change everything in your life. That includes telling all of your friends they are no longer welcomed around. Eventhough your at a time were you could use a friend but there is no one around. Anyways thats my thoughts and experiences.

As for if it makes a person more creative or not Ill leave you with this. Nostradamus and Edger Alen Poe both took acid, Beatles and verious other groups of that time definite pot heads, Eric clapton Coke Monkey, and who can forget Jimmy Hendrix who knows what he was shooting into that mellon of his. All definetly talented but did the drugs induce a different form of creativity?? :confused:

[lalimacefolle]

That's the problem with drugs. I'm totally against them (all drugs, including booze and tobacco, which is definitely one of the most addicting and dangerous one, but it's another debate) but when I hear those guys talking about their trips, I wish I could try one but without the addiction and the side effects. Vai wrote a song about a bad trip he had (somebody slipped a pill in his drink, that's what he says, but I guess he was curious, just like me)and several Hendrix's effects were inspired by what he heard in those trips, and he tried to recreate them when he was clean...

[kingdavid]

The hardest drug I've ever done is nicotine(or alcohol,if alcohol is the harder one,I dunno).And I've been in enuff situations with my cousins and friends(none of them musically inclined)getting stoned,but I just get the joint and pass it on.My curiosity(and I got quite some)hasn't allowed me to do these things;I already know they're harmful,so why bother "testing"?It's already been tested,proven and documented for me.
I finished some end-of-semester exams the other day.Now,every time after exams,we really(and I mean really)get drunk.But this time I was feeling down;the exams didn't go well for me,plus lately I've been thinking a lot about this whole "higher" education thing(I finished high school b4 my eighteenth bday,two weeks ago I turned 23,and I dont feel like i have anything to show for these 5 years).So I was a bit down.I didn't drink at all.You see,I dont drink to get happy,I drink coz I'm already feeling happy.
I dont think getting high helps your music.You cant be true to your heart when the faculties that get you to what is in your heart are impaired.

[nechako]

This is a good debat, I like hearing sober musicians are out there, and the trend to be a walking corpse is coming to a close. "..it increases the desire, but ruins the performance..";some quote out of a shakespear play, the character was commenting on wine.
How about shamanism...they used drugs to learn about the spirit world- however they didn't use for pleasure or abuse the substances.

Was Hendrix a modern day shamin-altering his "reciever" with substances to "tune" into things out of ordinary bandwidth?

I am sober...now...after a long road of delusion.
The hardest thing...giving up cigarettes,...especially durring playing

[spliphiticus]

sex, drugs and rock and roll? or is it the other way around rock and roll then sex then drugs =) unfortunately the rock and roll is what killed em first and thier weakness to abstane. In my experience I have noticed that in most cases where do you play? well bars, parties and such when you start, and there is always a PARTY and if you are happenin your invited. Alot of times these musicians where not junkies or alcoholics when they started but unfortunately for the music business it seems to be a givin that most will suffer some abuse of a substance etc. The point is there is a wave of fresh new musician who do abstane these days and get rest before big gigs and perform well. It is a PARTY carreer in many aspects. And drugs and booze and sex are senonimous (spelling ack) I am glad to hear more and more are finding thier creativity elswhere and not falling in the pits. Think I heard it in a 311 song "I'm high on life there are so many trips in it." or something like that. (sorry if I mis quoted but....)by the way the sex part is ok for the most part unless you break something and believe me it is handed out like candy if you ROCK =)

[Incidents Happen]

yeah but if you rock, then drugs are handed out like candy too.

[James]

Drugs are handed out like candy no matter what.

[Benoit]

I lost one of my closes friend at 14 years old. He died because he mixed too much drugs all at the same time. The thing is I didn't even knew he was on it, call me blind but I never picked up on it. That pretty much made me want to be as far as possible of drugs. I never judge somebody how did it but I never wanted to use them.

I played in only one band over the years. Back then we were into Death metal. The drummer always took some drugs before playing and after 4 songs was too frosted to play. After that experience, I deceided not to invest in music and turned to College.

I was kind of lucky to not fall in drugs and must say they don't contribute to better songwriting.

But I love taking a beer or two AFTER a good jam session.

[nechako]

I hear ya all, I used to jam with a bunch of guys the drugs and alcohol flowed more than the music, then the women, then the violence, then the jealousy; I ended up getting thrown around like a rag doll by some meathead at a jam resulting in a dislocated shoulder, fractured hand etc. .That was the last straw for me, I checked myself into a recovery centre.
Sobering up I realized I had to learn to live and play sober. And it is totally worth it, now my mind is clear enough to read music, write it teach it etc.

Bless ya awl

[PonyOne]

I applaud you, nechako, for having the balls to stand up and do something positive for yourself. I know a lot of guys and girls who would like to do that, but are too afraid of life without narcs or what everyone will think of them if they stop.

Interesting how so many get into music because they want to be an individual and express themselves in a unique and artful way, and then fall so hard into drugs and booze that they can't express anything.

I don't do ANYTHING narcotic. No tobacco, no weed, no booze, no beer, nothing. I prefer to let t flow from ME, and not get my artistic leanings from a can or a dimebag. I'm only 18 now have had to make myself stop being a drunkard... it's been three years almost. I used to think it was really cool and me and my friends would get totally pissed and go break things, get in fights with lumberjacks, etc. When you're 14 and feel like you've got no direction, it makes you feel so much bigger.
When i was in 8th grade I got put on Prozac for severe depression and had been on it for a couple weeks when my class went on the end of the year trip to New York to visit the WTC and Ellis Island and all that crap, and then to Washington D.C. for a few days. I ended up knocking back a beer that a friend had brought to prove I was cool, and then had some vodka on top of it, ten minutes after I took my pills. I remembered this right after I had the last sip and started totally flipping out; I was afraid for my life.

The humiliation made it so death would've been easier. I don't think that I can quite explain how creepy it is when you realize that you've been standing in the same place in the middle of the air and space museum for twenty minutes trying to gather your psychic abilities so you can float up to the top of the cieling and impress everyone in the place, then end up rocking back and forth on a bench trying to ignore the fact you're on fire so that you don't scream out and call attention to yourself.

Ultimately, I ended up realizing that the crap had already cost me one of my best friends (commited suicide while drunk, and the chronic booze had gotten him depressed enough to do it) and my grandfather; he lives in a motel somewhere near Spokane, WA, can't walk, and spends most of his days drinking & complaining about Jews & Negroes. So I quit. If you're so messed up you can't stand up straight, then there's no way you can play a guitar or sing correctly. You just sound like a moron to everyone else and degrade yourself musically. I don't really care if people have a beer or wine now and then, or even a joint on occasion, but it's not my cup of tea.

[nechako]

yep

[Incidents Happen]

i heard LSD that you go through another 'plane' like another world almost

[nechako]

the world is the sum of all your own perceptions- lsd changes perception therefore changing reality. "

[Raskolnikov]

Originally posted by Incidents Happen
i heard LSD that you go through another 'plane' like another world almost

Ever met somebody who's cooked their brain on LSD?
Higher plane my ass.

Granted, I know a lot of people who've used lots and are fine, but all it takes is one bad batch or one too many tabs... Also, the more you use, the closer you come to going too far. I have a friend who will start a mini trip if he cracks his back, another who'll spend hours watching bubbles in a fish tank because it brings flash backs.

Read or watch Fear and Loathing in Los Vegas for a "reformed users" perspective on this.

[James]

Originally posted by Raskolnikov
Originally posted by Incidents Happen
i heard LSD that you go through another 'plane' like another world almost
I have a friend who will start a mini trip if he cracks his back

Yeah I've heard about that type of thing. Isn't it because the chemical resides in your spinal column for a LONG time after the high is over (permanent sometimes?) and can create a high if you get a back massage or are in an airplane or something?

[Lordathestrings]

Originally posted by Incidents Happen
i heard LSD that you go through another 'plane' like another world almost Ideally you enter a state where your perceptions take on a dream-like quality. The downside is that most people have no way to control whether they have sweet dreams or nightmares. :eek:

[PonyOne]

One of my buds got really into weed and went on a mad quest to discover "new levels of height" you might put it... he tried LSD once and never tried it again, and eventually just stopped everything altogether.

One night driving home in the rain, the sight of the brake lights of the car in front of him through all the droplets on the window set him off, and he ended up wrecking... he was okay but the car wasn't. Certainly worth more than the one trip he took a year earlier. Talking to people who used to take LSD all the time can be wierd, they seem permanantely off, usually to a relatively small degree, but still off enough that it's creepy. And then they hear a wah-ed guitar or see a lava lamp and start drooling.

[James]

Originally posted by PonyOne
Certainly worth more than the one trip he took a year earlier. Talking to people who used to take LSD all the time can be wierd, they seem permanantely off, usually to a relatively small degree, but still off enough that it's creepy. And then they hear a wah-ed guitar or see a lava lamp and start drooling.

That's god damn creepy...

[jack7]

I spent half my life abusing drugs an alcohol
now I spending the other half straight!
(I love who I am now.):cool:

[nechako]

ying...now yang