Deep Emotion

[EPISODER]

I find it easy to write songs whenever I'm feeling very strong emotions.

Most of the time (sadly) the crappier I feel, the better of a song I write. Lyrics seem to come to me whenever I feel good, but melodies and beats just flow out of me when I'm down.

I write metal-core most of the time, but recently something came up with a girl I really care for, and I wrote the best song I've ever written, in 10 min. It was sort of like a metal ballad.


I really would like to know under what conditions you guys (and gals) write better songs.

[earthman buck]

I usually don't put pen to paper until I have at least a verse and a half worked out in my head. I tend to just pace around and think of how it should be worded, or concentrate hard on it as I'm doing something else. I pretty much just let it stew until I know where I'm going with it, then I write down what I have and the rest just flows out.

[Matt_Waldner]

when I'm angry/curious/sad/in love/afraid/whatever of something and express that on my instrument, usually that gives me better results than picking up my guitar and just trying to pull something out of my ass.

Having an emotion in place pretty much tells me what the song is going to sound like.

It goes hand in hand with knowing what you want to do before sitting down and writing a song. Knowing what and which emotion you want to express before composing the song is a key ingredient.

[earthone]

A song is not a song without emotions.. When I write I visulize the time and place. When the music and lyric are right it brings tears to my eyes. I love telling a story in under three and half minutes. A story that brings pictures to ones mind and they too, responnd with the emotion of dance, foot tapping, or buying another round.

[iiholly]

1) I write a page of random lines and somehow find a common them and duct tape a song together with chords.
2) Jamming at a party. Or just partying... If you know what I mean.
3) The whole emotions thing.
4) An incubus visited me the night previous and I have a sudden moment of inspiration the next day.

[looneytunes]

A song is not a song without emotions..

When I write lyrics, it has very little to do with my emotions. I may draw upon my past experiences and emotions, but it’s not anything I am going through at the time.
It usually takes 20 to 30 minutes for me to write a song and I have written hundreds of songs. I am always inspired to write starting with something I heard, or a cliché, etc. It maybe a name of a city, a smell, an oddity of sort, or even a joke that gives me an idea and it runs out of control from there. It could be anything! I guess my senses play more of role in my writing than my emotions.
I have written love songs, but it wasn’t because of my emotions at the time. I am involved in different campaigns and have written songs reflecting my views, but not my feelings or emotions. I guess I wouldn’t know how to start using my emotions. I mean, if I am sad or angry, I couldn’t concentrate enough to write. If I am depressed, the last thing I would do is write a song. I guess the same would go when in love, happy, etc. Probably the closest thing to writing while under an emotional situation would have been when I wrote poet while serving in South Viet Nam.
I am not saying that anything is wrong in using your emotions to write. I am just saying that is not the way I do it.

[Drew77]

I'd say emotion is not necessary as well. Usually when I write it is based around a concept or thought, or a story. I suppose in doing that often I am trying to communicate a feeling or occasionally an emotion, such as the emotion of a character but it is not really a result of strong emotions I am feeling.

Usually I am trying to communicate an idea or trying to get a particular reaction.

[earthman buck]

Yeah, if I'm feeling any emotion too strongly, I avoid writing songs like the plague. They're bound to turn out ridiculous. I think it's important to be able to stand back from emotion, so you can get a better look at it and perhaps understand it better.

[Drew77]

Thats a good point Earthman, it is hard to really understand something you are too close to.

Also writing things when emotions are high can result in you being to attached to a song to give it the necessary criticisms.

[iiholly]

When I write lyrics, it has very little to do with my emotions. I may draw upon my past experiences and emotions, but it’s not anything I am going through at the time.
It usually takes 20 to 30 minutes for me to write a song and I have written hundreds of songs. I am always inspired to write starting with something I heard, or a cliché, etc. It maybe a name of a city, a smell, an oddity of sort, or even a joke that gives me an idea and it runs out of control from there. It could be anything! I guess my senses play more of role in my writing than my emotions.
I have written love songs, but it wasn’t because of my emotions at the time. I am involved in different campaigns and have written songs reflecting my views, but not my feelings or emotions. I guess I wouldn’t know how to start using my emotions. I mean, if I am sad or angry, I couldn’t concentrate enough to write. If I am depressed, the last thing I would do is write a song. I guess the same would go when in love, happy, etc. Probably the closest thing to writing while under an emotional situation would have been when I wrote poet while serving in South Viet Nam.
I am not saying that anything is wrong in using your emotions to write. I am just saying that is not the way I do it.
Twenty to thirty minutes? I envy that! Do you ever have a problem leaving songs unfinished? I can't understand why I have such a block when it comes to finishing and its getting to point where all my songs are disorganized and unfinished and I just end up moving on. SO yeah some advice would be cool from someone who can write a lot of song in a quick amount of time on a whim.

[Drew77]

I have the same problem. What it is is absolutely forcing yourself to get through the song. The more you can finish songs the easier it becomes to get through them with out blocking. It's the same thing with painting, it's a sort of discipline.

Its like forcing yourself to do a 150 hour painting so that your 30 hour paintings are easier to get through. Plus the more you do it the easier it gets. So finishing songs will become easier because you will probably develop a particular tendencies of how you end them. All that will inform your song writing style and eventually it will be natural.

It's just hard forcing yourself to do it because for a while it isn't any fun.

[looneytunes]

Twenty to thirty minutes? I envy that! Do you ever have a problem leaving songs unfinished? I can't understand why I have such a block when it comes to finishing and its getting to point where all my songs are disorganized and unfinished and I just end up moving on. SO yeah some advice would be cool from someone who can write a lot of song in a quick amount of time on a whim.

When I say I usually write a song in 20-30 mins. I am talking about the lyrics only. The key to writing lyrics (in rhyme) is to practice and increase your vocabulary. The music part takes me longer, but I can usually complete the lyrics and a tune in a couple of hours. Embellishment and polishing takes much longer!

Yes, I have a file on my computer of unfinished songs, ideas, phrases and just words I like the sound of, such as, “pants” and others. I do go back to this file from time to time, but they usually go nowhere. I also have finished songs that I don’t like and do nothing with.

I usually get an idea, an inspiration, and the song writes itself.

I practice writing in rhyme by jotting down little tidbits. A helpful hint to writing in rhyme is there are exact rhymes, near rhymes, and adding and “s” or using slang. Don’t try to put a syllable on every beat. A good singer will make it work by hanging on the word or snapping it short.

Anyway that’s how I do it. There are many rules to songwriting, but rules are made to be broken.

[iiholly]

Rules aren't really what I was seeking, I was hoping for some really fresh magical advice that would suddenly turn me into an assertive writer. Maybe it would just help if I were a more assertive and organize person. As I've been tracking my songwriting abilities they just seem to be increasing over time. So probably by the time I'm 25 I'll be able to write a whole song in 20 to 30 minutes, without losing it or forgetting about it.
I'm the opposite way with lyrics and the guitar aspect. I just makes up little bits with guitar. Then later I'll proceed to string bits and pieces of guitar parts together to be matched to song.

[iiholly]

Rules aren't really what I was seeking, I was hoping for some really fresh magical advice that would suddenly turn me into an assertive writer. Maybe it would just help if I were a more assertive and organize person. As I've been tracking my songwriting abilities they just seem to be increasing over time. So probably by the time I'm 25 I'll be able to write a whole song in 20 to 30 minutes, without losing it or forgetting about it.
I'm the opposite way with lyrics and the guitar aspect. I just makes up little bits with guitar. Then later I'll proceed to string bits and pieces of guitar parts together to be matched to song.

[looneytunes]

Writing lyrics is magical! The lyrics come from inspiration and inspiration can come from anywhere!

You may see, hear, taste, touch, or even smell something that will inspire you to write. It maybe a person in your life, or person you would like to meet. I could be phrase you overheard or feeling you once had, but is magical. It’s magical because you weren’t thinking about writing a song, but you were inspired to write.

Putting your thoughts into rhyme is just practice. Some people have the gift of rhyme. I don’t. I have to work at it. Don’t under estimate your abilities. It’s like everything else in life. You have to work at it to make it a success. If it were easy, everyone would be doing it.

I have written lyrics for people that provided me the music or the idea. I really don't think there is much different for me, but when I write for myself I start with the lyrics. I fall in love with the lyrics of songs I heard long before I enjoy the music.

I don't know if this has helped you with your writing, but it may help you to understand the magic of song writing.

Just remember not to take anything I say to serious. I a little looney don't ya know!

[Drew77]

There is no advice that is going to make you better at anything. It is just about doing it a lot until you are good at it.

The best thing you can do other than writing is reading. Find lyrics yo love and really get into them. Find interviews with the song writer or things they have written other than lyrics. Immerse yourself in good music and lyrics and poetry.

The major difference between beginners and experienced songwriters (or anything really) is usually complexity of thought and how naturally they can apply that to their writing. As you write more and are honest with yourself about what your writing you'll learn how to think that way. Learning about great song writers and how/what they wrote is a great way to get clues on how you might progress and get better but it is all about actually doing it and not really about what you know.

All the rules and advice and guidelines in the world won't make you a good writer.

[looneytunes]

The best thing you can do other than writing is reading. Find lyrics yo love and really get into them. Find interviews with the song writer or things they have written other than lyrics. Immerse yourself in good music and lyrics and poetry.


To each his own, but I have never done this. I seldom even listen to others music. I could care less what others are doing. If I am on a long trip I might put in a CD and I do go to a few concerts from time to time. In my younger years I read some poetry and listened to more music than I do now. I'm just to busy to just sit and listen or read lyrics. I am inspired to write, I don't use anything or any structure or sound or style from anyone (other than songwriters format). My stuff is all original.

I might add lyrics or change lyrics for someones music. I had even taken a whole song that someone wrote and changed it completely, but it's at their request.

I guess you can learn from others. I am not putting down what you said. I just don't do it that way. It is true the more you do the better you become and more you enjoy it.

[Audrey4]

For me, it's to write a song, but I can easily change it in a good way and change the music, too! I really like to do that and soon, when I'll grow up, I'm going to be an arranger! :)

[looneytunes]

when I'll grow up, I'm going to be an arranger! :)

How old do you have to be? Start now!

[Drew77]

I am inspired to write, I don't use anything or any structure or sound or style from anyone (other than songwriters format). My stuff is all original.


No it's not. Not in the you mean anyway. My stuff is original too and I make it a point to listen to a lot of other music.

We all have ideas about what music sounds like and thats how we decide to write our music. Our ideas are all based on other music we have heard over the years. All the music we have heard is compressed down into an idea in our head which coordinates the way we create music. You aren't being more original by ignoring what other people are doing. I would actually propose that you are limiting yourself by not listening to lots of music, because you are drawing on a much smaller pool of ideas. This isn't necessarily true but it is possible.

It isn't a great idea to listen to only one band all the time, or just a few but it listening to a lot of music and really listening to whats going on is a great way to learn songwriting. Obviously then you have to take that theoretical knowledge and apply it to your songs and in doing so you learn more and grow as a songwriter. Maybe not everything you hear and love can be assimilated into your music the way you think it will but it will teach you about not only music but yourself as a musician.

If you aren't paying attention to what other artists around you are doing then you missing a great opportunity to learn. No one has all the answers by themselves and I know I am not anywhere near as talented or experienced as any of my idols or many other people so to not take the opportunity to learn from them and their hard won wisdom would be silly.

Looney I am not talking to you specifically. You have your way of doing things and if it makes you happy then thats fine, but for any young musicians, listening to a ton of music can really help you keep moving forward and evolving. Plus it isn't like listening to music is a hardship. Loving music is a prerequisite to writing good music.

[looneytunes]

I don't know. I did listen to a lot of music while growing up, but played very little. I now play a lot, but listen to music very little. If I'm driving on a long trip, I will play some CDs. Or I might go to an occasionally concert. I also hear others play live just messing around or at an festival. But I do not sit and listen to music hours on end. I love music, but have too many other things to do.

You are probably right in saying everyone is influenced by other's music. My just playing the guitar was influenced by others, but I don't hear something and try to duplicate it and claim as mine. I might learn a song or even change it, but it's not mine. I have rewritten lyrics to existing music, but I don't claim it as mine. Same goes when I rewrite the music.

I'm working on a song now that I heard a guy do live at the Peace Cafe in Dayton, Ohio. I liked the lyrics (somewhat), but did not like the way he played or sang it. So, I am rewriting all the music and changing some lyrics, but I will not claim it as mine. He was the originator.

So, I guess you can say I was influenced my is song.

[Commander Ooka]

Writing lyrics is magical!

hmm.... then where do I get more magical powers? I seem to be lacking them...

[looneytunes]

It appears magical to me, because I possess no special skills. I have to work at everything I do. I practice rhyming and I rely on inspiration. I have been given a subject and maybe a line to start off with by an artist, but then the magic kicks in. I am inspired my something that someone said or something I saw, something I dreamed, etc. Then the lyrics are written without much effort at all.
I mean some people have the gift, but I don’t. To write so many songs, that people seems to enjoy, without any special talents is magical.
It you want to write lyrics, I suggest you practice rhyming. Just start off rhyming words, then lines. Practice rhyming every other line, etc. Then practice choruses and verses. Don’t start out trying to make sense or to write a song. Just practice.
While practicing rhyming listen. Listen to people around you, sounds, study behavior, habits, pay attention to everything around you. Inspiration came come from anywhere, but you have to pay attention.

[MCBluesman]

A song is not a song without emotions.. When I write I visulize the time and place. When the music and lyric are right it brings tears to my eyes. I love telling a story in under three and half minutes. A story that brings pictures to ones mind and they too, responnd with the emotion of dance, foot tapping, or buying another round.

Putting myself in touch with an emotion rather than being overwhelmed by emotion is more my style. Many times I search to find a sound that I like first. I play around with the chords & fingerings that lay a nice groundwork. I might have a page full of verse & chorus ideas, but once the pot is boiling with some good tunes then I add the tasty verse. It seems to work for me.

[MCBluesman]

I catch myself getting hung on certain words as I go thru my daily routine. How they sound. Various meanings. What they could do in the right setting.

I noticed some famous artists use certain words or phases as "catch phases" to hook people. I wondered why that works so well.

Communication of an emotion or expression that paints a picture or story takes some thought & ability to reach people. I heard a critic use the word "relevent" recently....meaning the artist communicated to some recent theme or popular thoughts. Sounds a little over critical of the material to me, but I'm not trying to make a hit recording.

[looneytunes]

I noticed some famous artists use certain words or phases as "catch phases" to hook people. I wondered why that works so well.

Communication of an emotion or expression that paints a picture or story takes some thought & ability to reach people.

The "Catch Phase" or "Hook" is used to attract the listener early in the song. The average listener will get only devote a few seconds to a new piece or neew performer. If they are not attracted to the song or performer in that short time period they quit listening. That is why the "Hook" is so important. If the listener doesn't listen to your entire song the emotion or your personal expression won't matter, because most people aren't going hear it.

Of course, there are some who will listen to the entire song from start to finish, but the majority will not. That is way I say, if you are writing and performing for yourself, whatever you want to do is fine. However, if you are tring to attract an audience, publisher, artist, etc. the "Hook" is very important.

There are other things that make up a good song or performance, but don't under estimate the importance of the "Hook".

Just my opinion and we all know it ain't worth much!

[la'guit]

You dont write a song, the song writes you.

[looneytunes]

You dont write a song, the song writes you.

This statement doesn't make much sense to me, but if floats your boat!

I understand a song may seem to write itself. With some inspiration and your talents the words or tune just seem to fall into place quickly and effortlessly, so it appears to write itself, but "the song writes you"????

I must be missing something.

[Drew77]

Yeah, he's just being "funny" and saying the stupid stuff everyone else had the decency not to say. ;)

It's like," You don't look through the window, the window looks through you". You can do it with pretty much anything. And it actually makes sense if you do the right drugs.

[earthman buck]

Yeah, he's just being "funny" and saying the stupid stuff everyone else had the decency not to say. ;)

It's like," You don't look through the window, the window looks through you". You can do it with pretty much anything. And it actually makes sense if you do the right drugs.
It's true. That's where I got "the good thing is having bad things" and "not working makes it work." But then, it's also where I got "67 = 79 = bL."

Don't do drugs, kids.

[la'guit]

I agree this was a strange quote from me yet it means what ever you want it to mean. I like this statment because it is very open and you can make it out to be anything you want it to be. What im basicly saying is you could sit down for 20 years thinking of the perfect song but you have to feel it.

[norseindian]

Hey, i really like what you said, and Metal Core is amazing. Basics, i am 15 as well, and just got a guitar for Christmas. I have been playing for one full year. ( used my dads guitars before mine)

Anyway, i write songs by just sitting and playing. never when i am mad or happy, but just wanting to play. first i would learn stuff, and then i got out of it and just played my own way, and stuff. dont have a teacher. my dad is amazing, been playing since he was a kid, but i learn most of my stuff fomr tabs and youtube.

Example, sit there and play scales, and chords randomly until you find something cool, or that matches. then go from there.

The N.I.
My youtube page is youtube.com/norseindian but i dont have any of my own stuff up yet

[leaf]

MUSIC IS EMOTION! so if you having an emotional moment you will be easyer to write.

[musicizlife]

I'm good at thinking up guitar riffs when im alone in my room, guitar in hand...im not so good on thinking of lyrics. My friend tells me to just let it come to me, but nothing has yet. :(
But i love writing and trying out new tunings as well! :)

[liamhart]

I usually write songs to the best of my capability after a batch of mac and cheese.



regards.

[ChipShank]

I can tend to be a bit of an emotional whackjob.... :rolleyes: LOL
So highly emotional periods at either end of the spectrum usually aren't so productive for me. LOL
I tend to get more inspired by movies and/or some sort of visual stimulus. Movies, Frazetta paintings, the UFC or even Animal PLanet/Nat Geo all tend to serve as my best inspiration. Kinda cheezy perhaps, but it is mainly metal stuff that I write anyway, so......
Full on Spinal Tap mode! :p LOL

[ddaloia]

I really would like to know under what conditions you guys (and gals) write better songs.


:D Lot's of Alcohol. :D

[Kevin Taylor]

I find it easy to write songs whenever I'm feeling very strong emotions.

Most of the time (sadly) the crappier I feel, the better of a song I write. Lyrics seem to come to me whenever I feel good, but melodies and beats just flow out of me when I'm down.

I write metal-core most of the time, but recently something came up with a girl I really care for, and I wrote the best song I've ever written, in 10 min. It was sort of like a metal ballad.


I really would like to know under what conditions you guys (and gals) write better songs.


Perseverance.

Seriously.... I have a timeclock program on my computer and every time I sit down at it I click it on and count how much time I'm spending on songwriting and studio work.

On average I probably do 5 to 8 hours per day.

The general idea is, just sit there and do something.
Even if it sucks or you have no ideas at all... there's always something you can be doing like coming up with lyrical ideas, or loops, or riffs or even just general maintenance on your website or whatever.

At the end of the week I'm always surprised that I've spent 30+ hours or more working... even though to me it doesn't seem like work.

I think of it this way.

I've got a Sony PS3 that I play Grand Theft Auto on just as often as I work on music.
I just treat doing music the same way as playing the game.
It's a way to pass time and the more time you spend on it the better you get.

(and if anybody wants to get into a helicopter battle with me on GTA, gimme a shout.... I'll trash ya :)

[imperialism]

i find it hard to make lyrics,but i have finished the music for my song. its so hard to make the lyrics..

am i not too deeply emotion enuff?

[Kevin Taylor]

It's just life experiences from my point of view.

You should see some of my earlier songs. Majorly corny and laughable.
At the time I thought I was doing great, but now looking back I can see that I just didn't have enough of a vocabulary to draw on. Didn't have enough life experiences to draw on the emotions.

FYI:
If you can afford a couple of hundred bucks I'd highly recommend buying a program called MasterWriter specifically designed for song writers.
Besides having a well laid out method of writing songs, it also has every rhyme you'll ever need, a thesaurus, phrases, alliterations, references to pop culture, a dictionary and a notebook where you can sketch ideas.

Like all you do if you get stuck in a song is type in a word, hit a button and it gives you dozens of ideas.

Like, I just put in the word "Rain" and got back 3 pages of rhymes like, crane, drain, grain, champagne, John Wayne, ...
and rhymed phrases like:
Constant complaining
In the Time Remaining
An angel in training
etc etc..

Phrases:

A driving rain
A soft summer rain
Left out in the rain
Kissed by the rain
Burning candles in the rain...
Rain-washed dreams

From there you just double click on one's that might fit and it sticks them in a notebook for you. Then you can click on another word and continue until you find other words and phrases that either work... or give you ideas to work on.

[imperialism]

yea,maybe i shud try more harder..

[luggnut]

I find it easy to write songs whenever I'm feeling very s :D trong emotions.

Most of the time (sadly) the crappier I feel, the better of a song I write. Lyrics seem to come to me whenever I feel good, but melodies and beats just flow out of me when I'm down.

I write metal-core most of the time, but recently something came up with a girl I really care for, and I wrote the best song I've ever written, in 10 min. It was sort of like a metal ballad.


I really would like to know under what conditions you guys (and gals) write better songs.
I find that I come up decent melodies and lyrics hen i first wake in the morning with a clear head, this works well with top 40.

[SlapGuitarist12]

WHat i do is i just sit down with my guitar and i think.......for a very long time until i come up with something that makes sense then i put pencil to paper lay down the chord chart and what strings to press on what frets and the verses,interludes,riffs and stuff like that after i'm done with that i write down the words to the song and then work the other parts into my song so they sound good

[Kevin Taylor]

It's kind of amazing where songs come from sometimes.

On some occasions it's just been me sitting at a computer and forcing something to happen.
On other occasions, I'll be out riding my bike and a song will just come to me that gives me that 'homesick' feeling.
Other times, I'll be at a party, listening to some DJ music and coming up with a whole bunch of riffs and changes that I could have added to the song.

I'm not trying to push this song or anything cause it's probably about 10 years old by now but this is a good example of a song that came out of nowhere:
I was imagining what it might be like to be a father, singing a lullaby to my daughter (neither of which I was at the time), and the whole thing wrote itself in about 10 minutes.

http://s93744050.onlinehome.us/MP3s320/GoodnightMyLoveFemale_Schmange.mp3

Totally opposite to my usual style of hard rock. All the harmonies were done by myself using 16 tracks, and the girl who sang on it was 3000 miles away recording it in a closet at home.

Weird thing is, out of all the songs I've got posted on iTunes, this and the instrumental of it are my top sellers.

[Dielle Lodrick]

I agree with earthone that having a story to tell with some emotion in it is important for me as well as a songwriter.

I write all the time to keep my songwriting muscles flexed, but the ideas that come to me that grow into my better work, seem to come at me from all angles of life, and there seems to be no way of telling when that will happen.

For me, the skill is in honing your songwriting, so that you can effectively craft a good idea when you do get one.

Dielle

[James Erceg]

If you write a song or riff that sounds good after hearing it 100 times and that others tell you are good then you know you have something. I always look for that magic riff that the universe hides. Isn't it funny how the best riffs seem to write themselves, like just jump out of the guitar or your hands. Whenever I try to apply too much theory or scale patterns I feel dissapointed.

[Ben Lila]

Most of the time, when I write, the guitar part comes from an idea I got by just jamming out and playing around in the past. Then when lyrics start flowing out of me, which usually only happens when something dramatic or emotional happens, if I have a story of an adventure I went on or something. I fit them to riffs I've figured out on accident. Then once I make a melody for lyrics that fit with the main guitar riff, I follow lyrics, and figure out the chords to fit them for the rest of the song..... if that makes any sence.

[capitalalchemy]

When I was a kid, every time I thought that I was in love I would write beautiful music. Things would go sour and then I would write really hateful music. It bothered me so I started looking for inspiration elsewhere. I primarily found this simply by listening to a lot of world music, and my lyrics became quite philosophical and generally revolved around historical instances.

I decided that anything that I do that does not benefit me or mankind in some way is time wasted. Even if I am working on heavy metal compositions, I just really want to make people think, and do it without being political or throwing things in their faces.

I think art and political/religious/racial beliefs should be put in two separate rooms.

http://www.guitarticles.net

[staratarmy]

When I was a kid, every time I thought that I was in love I would write beautiful music. Things would go sour and then I would write really hateful music. It bothered me so I started looking for inspiration elsewhere. I primarily found this simply by listening to a lot of world music, and my lyrics became quite philosophical and generally revolved around historical instances.

I decided that anything that I do that does not benefit me or mankind in some way is time wasted. Even if I am working on heavy metal compositions, I just really want to make people think, and do it without being political or throwing things in their faces.

I think art and political/religious/racial beliefs should be put in two separate rooms.

http://www.guitarticles.net

i couldn't a agree with you more, im working on a concept album alot like that, political in my mind but i want to use story's from other places and other ppl to make ppl think about it and come to the same conclusion as me. what do you think?