Jazz

[Akira]

is insane.

So far, through my study of Jazz theory, I've learnt:

- Substitute every chord you can
- Keys dont exist
- Just make up chords as you go along, and for some reason, it works
- The prettiest chord I have ever heard is the dom11 chords

I think I may have even grown a few grey hairs.

[Akira]

Oh, and something about the top note in the chord being important when linking or substituing chords. :rolleyes:

[ren]

"If you play a bum note, play it twice... that's Jazz"

I heard Dave Navarro say it, but it's doubtless not his... I loved it - studied Jazz in my late teens... I liked the 13ths more than the 11ths, but yeah, it's all good. The 'add11' chords are nice too - quite sparse sounding. Hard to work into a rock tune though IMO.

Anyway, as long as everyone in the band likes to play the same thing, you can all pretty much play what you like... John Schofield for instance plays at times seemingly random chromatics... but it works (mostly!).

Sounds like you're getting loads more from Uni than I did man... :)

[Akira]

"If you play a bum note, play it twice... that's Jazz"

I heard Dave Navarro say it, but it's doubtless not his... I loved it - studied Jazz in my late teens... I liked the 13ths more than the 11ths, but yeah, it's all good. The 'add11' chords are nice too - quite sparse sounding. Hard to work into a rock tune though IMO.

Anyway, as long as everyone in the band likes to play the same thing, you can all pretty much play what you like... John Schofield for instance plays at times seemingly random chromatics... but it works (mostly!).

Sounds like you're getting loads more from Uni than I did man... :)

Oh, i'm done with uni until the end of September lol; this is my own study. I'm working through a book by Ted Greene called "Chord Chemistry", it's great. Leaves you with a sore head after a while though. :p

[Julian Vickers]

So you're at music school huh? Are you studying jazz in particular as a major?

Man when you get to third year in my Jazz school, the theory gets totally whack ;)

Keys do exist, but what is important about jazz is tension, and the resolution of that tension. You can of course start subsituting chords left and right that don't fit within the parent key, but as long as they resolve in a meaningful manner, they won't fit or sound good.

[Weslaba]

A good friend of mine is a phenominal sax player. He is probably the biggest fan of Jazz I've ever met, and when you hear him play, you'll instantly know why. But aside from that, his theory knowledge is absurd. He shows up the teachers in theory classes. I recall one class when the teacher (Berklee grad) was explaining how to go about soloing through a chart, and he paused and said, "Hey Colin, (who at the moment was jazzing it up on the keyboard through some headphones)... Just so I make sure I'm doing this right, how would you solo over this?" He then went on to explain how over the G7add9dim8aug4 he would use the aeolian mode and that at the end of the measure he would hold a certain note for tension that would resolve with the next chord. Confused looks arose on the noobs faces in the class, but the rare few of us who almost understood what he said were stunned to say the least. On the upside, playing in a jazz combo with him could not be greater. Half the time, he doesn't even need the charts, just BS's the whole thing from memory then spices it up like its his own. It's a great motivator though, because it really shows that if you know all of your theory, the sky is the limit. :rolleyes:

[RobSm]

...well...jazz is a moving target.

It's gone from 30's show tunes via 40-50's bebop to reactionary cool into modal and of course the free formers.

I think it got so abstract that charts became just another obstacle course for the soloists..and there are only a finite number of chords that can follow any preceding chord so once it was all done the modal guys dropped the concept altogether.

Picking up on a preceding post..like it or not, and as wonderful as Wes Montgomery was, the sax is at the heart of jazz.

So I suggest following some John Coltrane through from Monk & Miles Davis through to his own groups to Ascension. (don't leave out Greensleeves - I love it..but our sax dude turns ..er...green :o at the mention of it)

If you can sort of 'follow' and like what's going on..you've got it!! :D

No need to try to define it.

RobSm

[light487]

If you can sort of 'follow' and like what's going on..you've got it!!

That about sums my thoughts on jazz, and for that matter, any work of art.

[RobSm]

is insane.

So far, through my study of Jazz theory, I've learnt:

- Substitute every chord you can
- Keys dont exist
- Just make up chords as you go along, and for some reason, it works
- The prettiest chord I have ever heard is the dom11 chords

I think I may have even grown a few grey hairs.

Just on the substitution..there needs to a path from any point to a 'target'

to try to illustrate...if you take 'Over the Rainbow' first few bars..

Eb///|Gm///|Ab

The the George Shearing Sub

A7b5b9/D7#5b9/|Gm7 Fm7 Em7 A7b5b9|Ab

some where | o ver_the rain bow | birds

(Sorry the formatting is lost when the message is posted) :mad:

You can see that there's movement of 5ths, diatonic & chromatic steps to get to the Ab. While the names might give you a headache he's just stacked an Eb triad on a dominant A & D .

Also two notable 12 bar blues 'substitutions' Bluesette and Wave.

If you can follow the 'trail' through these subs the ideas will start to flow.

[musicianmaker]

Mozart said "music is noise."
Count Basie said " If it sounds good it is good."
There's a reason they call it "Theory"
Maybe if you look at it this way. Sometimes you need the theory so you know what is you just did, figure out where you are and not how you got there.




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